A great event. Like Red Fish said, the weather was the best that I can ever remember for an MMD. wind was very lite, jackets, etc. did not even come out until around 10pm. We had 43 people that signed in, and I believe (probably due to the great weather) most all made it until midnight.

Our winners for 2012 were:

Bob G-StipeSideChaser- 1st Place with a 56#

Edwin H- (a guest)- 2nd place with a 40#

Tim Nguyen-Sfork- 3rd place with a 32#

There were also several breakoff’s leading me to believe there are some big rays at the pier right now (if you fish for them please handle them carefully and of you are not keeping them, please return to the water asap….)

Big Thanks to Sofa King for stepping up and pretty much handling all the pre-work when I could not. Also thanks to Big Rich for hauling all the gear to the pier, Chip and the rest of the guys from The City Of Berkeley for hauling all our stuff out onto the pier on the golf carts, Red Fish for donating that beautiful Striper pictured above for the potluck (nothing better than fresh fish fried up right on the spot, GDude for getting the trophy’s and all the other unsung work he does, everyone who donated for the potluck and to everyone who came out to fish, have a good time and show your support. At the end of the day, you, the members and guests are the reason we put in all this effort and do any event.

Posted by Red Fish — Another successful event! Good seeing all the familiar faces, some that have been there every year for 11 years! Thanks to Sofa King and son, ICA2 and sons, Gyozadude and son, Bigrich for putting forth a tremendous effort in sponsoring this event to make sure everyone had an enjoyable time. Congratulations to SSC (for protectin’ the Griffin rep) and all the other derby winners! Oh, and someone did high-stick at the end, and broke their rod at the top and the bottom as a powerful ray dove under the pier. I have never seen a rod so tweaked in my life (totally a wipeout). The best weather we have ever had at an MMD. Ken Jones, you were missed, but you were there in pierfishing spirit!

Posted by West Coast Dave — I had a great time this year, even though I only manage to feed the crabs (I also caught one of those bait stealers, a nice Dungeness crab that I released).

By the way my streak of Mud Marlin Derbies continued with this one being the 11th. I think that Redfish and I are the only people on the message board who have never missed a derby. And Redfish probably has three hours of derby time more than me, because one year I came three hours late at 9 P.M. from a wedding I had to attend in S.F. Is there anyone else out there that has also attended all 11 derbies?

The weather was great, but not the best at the derby. The first one back in 2001 and a couple others were held on windless warm days where it was so hot and humid on the pier, we were down to wearing t-shirts. Tight Lines, and I hope to see everyone next year in 2013!! And thanks to everyone who made this such a great event.

Posted by Ken Jones — Good job guys, wish I could have been there.

Bat Ray caught at the Morro Bay North T-Pier

Date; October 20, 1999
To: PFIC Message Board
From: Sam
Subject: Dangeous Stingray

I just found text below on the Net when I was trying to learn about stingray. The tail of the stingray sounded deadly, going near one doesn’t seem like a wise thing to do. Does swing its tail around like a creature from out of space? How do you make sure the tail doesn’t strike you? How do you distinguish it from the Bat Ray? Some detail information would be appreciated. Sam

STINGRAY
Phylum Chordata, Class Chondrichthyes. These possess a serrated bony spine at the base of the dorsal surface of the tail. An integumentary sheath discharges venom when ruptured. Most injuries occur when the ray is stepped on, the tail is thrust upward and forward and fired into the foot or leg. The venom is thermolabile (deactivated with heat) and induces severe vasoconstriction.
Symptoms: Intense pain is felt at the site; there is local ischemia (loss of blood supply), and edema. Edges are jagged, may contain pieces of spine and secondary infection is common. Systemic effects include salivation, sweating, vomiting, diarrhea, cramps, hypotension (low blood pressure), and cardiovascular collapse.
Treatment: Irrigate and remove remaining spine. Immerse in hot (50 C) water until pain subsides. Give local or systemic pain relief. Cleanse, debride and suture the wound. Give tetanus protection, infection prophylaxis and monitor / support cardio-respiratory system as indicated.

Posted by Ken Jones

I’ve fished from California piers for nearly 40 years, caught hundreds of sting rays/and bat rays and never been stung. (1) Learn to identify your fish. Buy my book or another book that contains pictures and read the descriptions. (2) Be patient and careful when handling the rays. (3) I generally grasp the tail of a sting ray with a pair of needlenose pliers and then remove the hooks before letting the fish go.

Posted by Mike Kai

It seems that people are afraid of stingrays as they are sharks. For a bat ray/sting ray to sting you, its tail must move vertically, exposing the stinger. This usually only happens when someone steps on a ray, especially when wading at the beach. However, to be stung on pier is pretty rare. I think it is STUPID and a WASTE for someone to cut off a bat ray’s stinger, it increases your chance of being stung, and it does great harm to the fish. I seriously doubt that the stinger will grow back in 6-8 weeks, if ever. This is the fact that the stinger is made of cartilage, the same material its wings are made of, which don’t grow back. This just makes me mad, it reminds me of going to the pier and watching retards step on short halibut or rays, then throw the dead fish back!

Round Stingray caught at the Coronado Ferry Landing Pier

Posted by tony

Last year at Bakers beach, my uncle caught a small stingray, around 20lb.’s. I was helping him take out the hook, I thought I was stepping on the tail, but the tail managed to squirm out from under my leg, My foot was between the part that connects the tail to the body, and the left wing. I was wearing tuff shoes, and it STUNG me; hurt like a .B. The dagger went through my shoe, and scraped on my bone; it electrocuted me! I felt the electricity, and it injected venom through my leg. It hurt for a few hours; still have the triangular scar on my foot and, hasn’t changed since the day it happened. It REALLY SUCKED

Posted by goatfish

Just try a little caution and common sense…A stingray can sting without warning, and it doesn’t have to be a vertical whip of the tail. Personally, I like to turn them over on their backs while I’m removing a hook, etc. but I try to stay away from getting near the tail at all. If you cut off the stinger, it WILL grow back, much like your fingernails will grow back when you cut them. More often than not, people get stung by rays because they are not paying attention, or are intrigued by the stinger and want to touch it. I’ve yet to catch a ray where the stinger was not exposed, and they WILL sting you if given the opportunity. I’ve seen people get stung, and it is not a pretty sight. Just remember to be alert and use common sense.

Posted by Anthony

Anyone ever thought about cutting the line and leaving the hook? They will rust out quicker than the stinger will come back.

Posted by Ken Jones

I actually learned about the removal of the spine and its ability to grow back from visits to the Monterey Aquarium and Chula Vista Nature Center. Both places have petting pools with bat rays in them and allow kids to pet the bat rays. After talking to people at both places I discovered that they clip off the stinger so that the bat rays cannot sting the children. Apparently it takes 4-6 weeks for the spines to grow back because they have to do this little operation on a regular basis to prevent the spines from becoming dangerous. By the way, the bat rays, minus their stingers, are about the friendliest fish you will see.

Posted by Kanamit

Ken, You are correct – I learned this too at the aquarium. The problem is sometimes that the Barnies on the pier cut off the entire tail of the ray. If this is done I don’t believe the tail and stinger can grow back. I’ve actually seen idiots cut off the tail and miss the stinger entirely – it’s too bad these retards didn’t get stung after thinking they cut off the stinger. I feel it is totally irresponsible to fish for a species of fish without learning a little about it first. It is fine to snip off the stinger but leave the tail alone! I have caught hundreds of rays and although I used to cut the stingers off I don’t really bother anymore. If you are careful I don’t believe it’s necessary.

Bat Ray caught at the Fortman Marina in Alameda

Date: June 28, 2000
To: PFIC Message Bard
From: moe
Subject: SF Bay — Bat Ray vs. Sting Ray

Had a few q’s regarding the bay rays:
1: What’s the diff. b/w bat rays and sting rays, and how can I tell?
2: What do you do when you catch one, use a gaff or net, and if you gaff it…where on the body should I do that if I will be taking the critter home?
3: Once caught, is there anything I should do to ensure a good meal eg. bleeding, or kill them somehow?
4: Yesterday I caught something that looked like a manta ray actually,,, I didn’t get a good look at it because as I was pulling it up on the pier, it tore 20# test….could have been a halibut…
5: Which ones should I keep to take home and eat…sting vs bat ray; big one vs. small one…. and I know the wings are the good part… what about the body or tail? any help will be appreciated, dr.moe

Posted by Nate D

Moe-Bat rays have very large heads, ear holes (I use these to grab them when I pitch them back in the water), and are brownish-black on top and white on their bellies. I have never caught an actual stingray in the S.F. Bay (where I fish) but I have caught a thornback ray or two. When you get a bat ray out of the water, they will huff and snort quite a bit. They have big cow-like eyes. Funny thing about a bat ray, they’ve got black eyes, lifeless eyes like a doll’s eyes.
With large fish caught in bay waters, the sooner you clean the fish the better. This immediately rids the fish of toxins and parasites in the innards.
I have either hoisted it up by the ear holes or used a hoop net to bring it up from the pier. I don’t use gaffs, at all.
I doubt you caught a manta ray, they are off shore species and usually do not eat large baits.
A good basic rule to follow is the larger the fish, the longer it has been swimming in the water, and if that water is subject to pollution, therefore the longer it has been absorbing said pollution. I personally don’t keep striped bass over 28 inches or so, for an example. Remember that bat rays have no bones, just cartilage and fat, in addition to muscle. A flat piece of cartilage runs straight through the middle of the wing, and if you fillet the meat on either side of this, you should get four nice fillets. I personally would not eat a ray when there are perch, bass, or sturgeon to be caught, but many people do eat them. If the flesh smells ammonia like, soak the fillets in salted milk for 24 hours. Also, Ken Jones knows quite a bit about the preparation of bat rays. Give ‘Em Hell, Nate D

Posted by moe

Thanx for the reply Nate… are the smaller rays better eating than the bigger ones….maybe they would have less pollution in them?

Posted by Ken Jones

One and The Same. Probably 90% or more of the anglers around San Francisco Bay call bat rays sting rays and yes, they do indeed have a stinger/spine by their tail.
Rarely if ever would you catch a round stingray, diamond stingray or butterfly ray this far north. And manta rays are creatures more common to Baja waters — indeed they’re even very rare to southern California.
As for their edibility, they’re good. They are a little bit of a pain to clean; you need a strong and sharp knife. However, the bone-free meat has an interesting taste and texture.
Although I used to always use a pier gaff (at least on the higher piers), a net is better. A net allows you to release unharmed the smaller fish—and the larger fish if so inclined. A ray brought up from the depths by way of a pier gaff is probably not going to survive. To be honest though, many anglers, including myself, today release most of the bat rays we catch. They’re great fun to catch and deserve to fight another day. But that is a personal decision.

Posted by moe

Struck out twice vs. huge rays; guys I need some help. I have struck out two nights in a row on the ol’ mighty bay ray…. One took me out like 150 yards, then came back straight at me, by the time I caught up with him he was already under the pier, getting himself ready to wrap me around one of the posts… and as you figured, indeed he wrapped me around not once but several times, and the 30 pound shock leader I had broke!!… You gotta love it!! This guy must have been huge…I felt as if my 12’ surf rod was going to snap in half!!
The other one, I didn’t even get the chance to adjust my drag…. he took the bait…. then just took off…. I set the hook but he just kept running, till me line snapped again…. twice in the same night…Don’t know what the second one was…. maybe a shark or a ray? I need some help on the issue…. any suggestions for next time I go out? thanx

Posted by Leapin Bass

1) Use a conventional reel instead of a spinning reel. A high speed reel will help your first problem although they do that sometimes and there’s nothing you can do about – part of fishing from a pier. I’ve never caught a yellowtail from a pier and the pilings are the reason why.
2) Use a 7 or 8 ft. rod rated for 20 – 40 lb. test (or somewhere in bewtween) designed for use with a conventional reel. I’ve seen so many people loose rays because they simple can’t control them with those long surf rods.
It’s much easier to fight large fish on conventional gear. You use your bicep instead of your wrist and forearm. The drags are usually better and even if they’re not you can always loosen it a bit and control it with your thumb (be careful not to burn your skin off). You can set the alarm instead of loosening the drag (which will eliminate the second problem you had). I don’t mean to toot my own horn but I can cast further with my 7 ft. Musky rod and Daiwa SL30SH with 20 lb. test further than anyone I’ve ever seen on Goleta pier with one of the ridiculously long surf rods and spinning reels. Anyone can do it with a little practice.
I have caught countless large (up to 56 inch wingspan) rays on medium casting rods and I’ve never used anything more than 30 lb. test. These days I stick to 15 and 20 (25 if a friend who doesn’t fish much is with me – on his/her rod).
With a decent rod and reel and a few rays under your belt you can easily handle most of them on lighter tackle – not to mention it’s much more fun and challenging.

Posted by Monkfish

Funny thing about a bat ray….. they’ve got black eyes, lifeless eyes like a doll’s eyes…. Hey Nate D….sure your name isn’t really “Quint?” Just when you thought it was safe to fish the piers again.

Date: October 1, 2000
To: PFIC Message Board
From: mobilesuit
Subject: STING RAYS

I heard that when you catch a ray, you are supposed to cut the stinger off. If this is true, how are you supposed to do it? So I cut the whole tail off or just some part of it? Thanks.

Posted by Iso Lunkers

No… No cutting anything off. First of all, you need to make sure it is a “sting ray” and not something that has no stinger in the first place. Then, you want to bring a towel to grab its tail so you do not get slapped with it, plus it is one of the only ways to hold them when throwing them back in and unhooking them. I have seen people cut the tail off and that is just plain cruel. I hope this helps.

Posted by mobilesuit

Thanks for the feedback. So basically you don’t do anything to it right? k. Oh and um, when you do hold the ray, where do you hold the tail with the towel? And how thick should the towel be? It just seems like I can still get stung, even with a towel. Well, thanks again for the feedback. Good fishing.

Posted by Black Marlin

Mobile-I have landed well over 500 bat rays and skates since I started fishing for them at 12 years old. I used to cut off the stinger from rays when I was young if it was really big, as the stingers reflected the overall size of the ray. I kept them in my tackle box and they served as a sort of status symbol in the pecking order that existed in the small culture of ray fishermen in my town (Sausalito, CA). Now, I still fish for and catch many rays each year but as a wiser, more cultured man I’ve dropped the stinger cutting and replaced it with a cheap camera and tape measure. I think if you are going to catch and release any fish, it must be returned to the water as it came out, minus the hook in it’s mouth. No exceptions. Best of luck. Give ‘Em Hell,, Black Marlin

Posted by Leapin Bass

Although it is not necessary, cutting off the stinger is okay if you really feel you need to because it will grow back relatively quickly (they do this in aquarium touch tanks like the one at the Monterey Bay Aquarium). Definitely do not cut off it’s tail because then it’s stinger (which is it’s only method of defense) can not grow back. It also helps to know where the stinger is – at the base of the tail. Some people think it’s on the tip of the tail.
One time at Goleta I saw some guy who was fishing with a bunch of rods, keeping illegal-sized bocaccio and using them for bait. He caught a small bat ray, cut the tail off thinking he was safe and then got nailed by it’s stinger as he threw it back (oh yeah I forgot to mention that the jerk gaffed it to bring it in – then released it!). Anyway, him and his buddy left immediately (I assume to a doctor or hospital) which gave me his spot on the end of the pier.
I’ve seen a few people cut only the tails off and not the stingers but this was the first guy I saw get nailed. I felt it was justice for all the other crap he was doing illegally.

Posted by Ken Jones

If you are in a group it is often possible to have one person hold the tail (with a towel) while you remove the hook; then let the stingray go. However, I am often alone and at times it may be hard to remove the hook in a safe manner, especially if the fish is hooked deep. What I do then is to grasp the tail with needlenose pliers and cut off the stinger (spine). The ray is then safe to handle and the stinger will grow back in approximately 4 weeks time. DO NOT cut off the entire tail.

Posted by readership

Is there a trick to bringing up big fish (such as stingrays) when you are fishing alone? I was at Pacifica Pier the other night and landed a fatty smooth hound shark. Luckily there were some crabbers to help me out, whom I gave the catch too. otherwise, winds blowing, flashlights barely shining, eyes straining, whew…fish on!

Posted by Leapin Bass

Walk it to the beach if you have a fishing license. Otherwise – good luck!

Posted by mobilesuit

What are the chances of getting stung? I was wondering what were the chances of getting stung by a stingray you just caught. (When you’re shore fishing that is). I don’t know if you’re supposed to but I always go into the water about knee or thigh deep to cast, because I have a short rod and am also not the best caster. Thanks for the help. gl fishing

Posted by Leapin Bass

According to the guys in Grand Cayman stingrays do not sting when they are swimming around – only when they are sitting on the bottom. When you wade in the ocean don’t take steps – instead shuffle your feet which will scare the stingray and cause it to move.

Posted by mobilesuit

Stingray on its back. If a stingray is on its back, will it not be able to sting you? Heheh just a thought from an earlier question. Thanks for your time. gl fishin

Posted by Red Fish

A Serious Question, Right? A good one too. Many anglers that catch stingrays (O.K., proper name Bat Ray’s Ken!) for the first time don’t have a clue how to properly un-hook them or of the potential danger of being stung. The first time I caught one, about age 14, I was clueless. Two guys that called themselves helping me, cut the poor ray’s tail off, then I threw him back. They told me, “oh, he will grow another one just like a lizard.” I don’t know that to be a fact, but it is senseless to cut off a ray’s tail and I have never done it on the dozens of ray’s I have released over the years. O.K., yeah, I believe turning a ray over GENTLY on his back is the best way of un-hooking it. This way the ray’s stinger in face down. If you look at a ray’s tail, there is only one small stinger located at the front of tail anyway very similar to a catfish’s spines on its head.
So, after that long explanation, the answer to your question is No. A stingray will not be able to sting you on its back (it would be very difficult to do so.) Anyway, if it’s on its back the hook is in its mouth, right? O.K. you shouldn’t be standing near its butt when you’re taking out the hook! Hold the ray’s tail down with your foot if you’re really worried about being stung.
Oh-lastly, ever so important. When you go to release this puppy, hold it near the head (mouth) with the tail away from you when you go to throw him back!!!! Hope this helps.
I am curious to know if anyone on this board has ever been stung by a ray? Please share your story with us.

Posted by ikiller

I was stung once. My stinging story: I was fishing on either McNears Pier or Paradise Pier, I can’t quite remember. Well I caught a rather small ray with probably a foot and a half wingspan. I wasn’t very familiar with the handling techniques since I had just started saltwater fishing. I was hauling it up by the fishing line, and I guess I was too close to the railing. Somehow it whipped its rear end through the railing and stung me in the side of my left calf. I did not notice that I was stung for a few minutes while I was dealing with the fish. The stinger (or whatever you would call it) went through my jeans and at least a half-inch into my skin. It wasn’t that painful of a wound. It was kind of a mild cold shooting pain that persisted for a few days.
When I catch a ray on the beach here is my technique: Drag him up out of the water onto the beach (not too far from the waters edge). Grab it by the front edge of a wing and flip it over. Remove the hook, stand on the tail if necessary. After the hook has been removed, put a hand under the leading edge of each wing and flip the whole thing over head over tail. If you have done this technique correctly (and you were close enough to the water) you will have turned the ray over and flung him back into the surf.

Posted by tony

I have been stung by a ray once. I was out at Baker’s Beach a few years back fishing for some stripers, and my uncle landed a small ray, maybe 2 feet in diameter. We flipped it on it’s back, and started to take out the hook, I was wearing some Nike sneakers with flat bottom soles. I pressed the tail down into the sand to stop it from whipping back and forth as I held on to the line so my uncle could take out the hook.
Some how, the ray managed to free its tail and stab my ankle with it’s dagger. It went through my shoe, my sock, through my skin, and it did hit the bone in my ankle. There I felt a mild electric current flow through my leg as it throbbed while the blood oozed out. It hurt like a b!tch. I screamed and yelled as I tried to hold back from the pain. Basically, it sucked, the scar hasn’t gone away, and the wound looks the same as if it were the day when it happened. tony

Posted by Black Marlin

Mobile-One thing people are omitting when talking about getting stung by rays is the ray’s tail itself. On a mature ray (40# and up) the tail is like a bullwhip, and the ray can use it as such. I have been thrashed by a ray’s tail a couple of times and it drew blood and left welts both times. Either use a glove and hold the tail or cover it with a towel and hold it down with your foot. I have landed and released well over 500 rays in my years and the best way to remove a hook is with the ray on it’s back holding down the tail with your foot. Happy fishing!!!! Black Marlin

Posted by papa

I use this technique of using a towel on the tail also. When I throw the ray back I usually pick it up with my thumb and index finger in what I think are the gills on top of the head. Is this a good way to handle a ray. Its tail can not reach up to my arm and I always hold it away from my body. Just curious.

Date: September 7, 2001
To: PFIC Message Board
From: neptune 1234
Subject: bat ray stingers?

Hey. do bat rays actually sting with their “stinger?” I know what they look like and I have a few small ones. Kinda like a little knife in a sheathe at the base of the tail. Really sharp and barbed. Could cause some serious lacerations. But does a live stingray posses venom or a painful fluid besides that? Not that I plan on finding out the hard way anytime soon. Anyone know anything about this?

Posted by Leapin Bass

Do not find out! They do sting with their stinger and it SUCKS! I don’t think what stung me was a bat ray. Since it was so shallow I believe it was a round stringray but I’m not sure since I didn’t see it. In either case it was probably the worse pain I’ve ever felt (and I’ve been through some pain!). It was two weeks ago and the area around the puncture is still slightly swollen and sore.

Posted by Surfan

Leapin Bass would know!

Date: May 3, 2002
To: PFIC Message Board
From: pescador5312
Subject: Pier nets?

Man I need a net for bat rays. I looked all over the place. Fact is they don’t make those landing nets anymore. At least that’s what I’ve been told by the tackle shops in SD. I mean, if you just want something to bring up a bass or a barely legal halie with then a crab net should do. But for bat rays I had to go and buy a nylon tailgate net for a truck. I attached some rods to the ends to keep them open and tied about 25ft of line to each end. I haven’t gotten the opportunity to use it yet but I think it will do fine. But just for the big fish. I’ll probably post more about it if I ever get to use it and it works. But hey, if you’re looking for something of the same nature and you find one, let me know!
don’t bother me… I’m fishin. <*)))>=<| pescador5312

Posted by PierHead

Good idea! And portable too – you just roll it up. I got several questions:
1. How big a ray can be pulled up by net? Are their special techniques when hauling up a load like some of Stan’s beasts?
2. How did you tie off the 2 lines to the net – I could see the net revolving (horizontally) and tipping the fish out. Did you string it up like a hammock?
3. Will the rules inhibit the cutting off of the ray’s stinger? How does everyone feel about that?
Tight Lines! PierHead

Posted by pescador5312

1. I don’t know how big a ray can be hauled up since I haven’t gotten the opportunity to use it yet. But it is very portable and saves a lot of space.
2. Yes it is strung up like a hammock. My plan (for when I do hook up) is to have two people ready with each rope (whereas I can be one of them). I just guide the monster into the net kinda like a trout cradle net. Then bring both of the ropes together to haul the fish up. It should be in the position where the wings will just be bent upward when the net is closed so the tail doesn’t get caught in the holes. It just hangs off the side.
3. I’m not going to make it to the derby. Wish I could so I can’t answer that. But I myself don’t like to take the stinger off regardless of whether or not I feel I might be in danger by leaving it on.

Posted by Songslinger

I Leave The Stingers On. I don’t see the point of returning a fish to the water without its natural defense system intact. But others like to carve out stingers for their collection and the stingers will grow back. So I guess it’s personal choice. If the issue is safe handling, then you really don’t need to remove the stingers so much as keep alert. Pretty obvious, in my opinion, where the sharp end is; you just have to avoid it. A good landing net is preferable. A crab ring is best for piers. The less damage you do to these creatures, the better. I tend to cut the hook with a wire cutter if it means the difference between the creature’s comfort and my tackle. Also, and I’m not signaling anyone out here, I don’t care about taking pictures and rarely pull my fish onto the bank.

Posted by boomer334

Leave the stinger

Posted by Sinker

I will hold its tail while you remove the hook. The problem I have is when lifting the dog gone beasts up over the railing is when it gets a little scary. I have been hit twice that way but never while removing hooks. It does hurt like hell. I am allergic to bees and have to carry an Epi Kit with me but the Bat Ray sting has never caused me to go into shock. These new Kits are nice they auto-inject rather than the ole syringe “Get Bent” “Sinker”

Bat Ray at the Elephant Rock Pier in Tiburon, 2003

Posted by Ken Jones

Heck, you were willing to grab hold of those scorpionfish even though they were new to you. As I recall one ALMOST stuck you. Discretion sometimes trumps courage.

Date: October 21, 2002
To: PFIC Message Board
From: RaySniper
Subject: Cutting off a Bay Ray’s Stinger?

The other night I caught a Bat Ray that no longer had its stinger. From the looks of the wound/scar, it looked like somebody had cut the stinger off with a blade then threw the Ray back in the water. I guess the question to ask is why somebody would decide to catch the ray, cut off its stinger, then throw it back? Does the stinger have some sort of use for humans of which I am not aware, or was this just a pointless act of cruelty?

Posted by Songslinger

Some people like to keep stingers as trophies. I’m told the rays grow them back eventually. Even so, and this is my personal taste, I would prefer not to release anything shorn of its natural defenses.

Posted by Mike. C

Agree with Slinger on sending the ray back without its means of defense. That thing evolved to be there for a reason and we shouldn’t screw with it. But as far as a random act of cruelty, I wouldn’t go so far to say. The folks at the aquarium say that it causes no pain to the rays when they cut the stinger and they do grow back.

Posted by neptune1234

I always keep the stingers. Have a pretty good collection going too. Except I don’t cut them off. If you grab it at the base with a pair of needlenose pliers and lean it backwards they pop right off. NO sweat. Only a couple second operation. NO real harm to the ray. They’re mainly for use when they are babies anyway. I count them as trophies and put them on my weird fish stuff shelf. Always a nice addition. I suppose you could make earrings out of them.

Posted by RaySniper

Interesting…thanks for the info. I guess that it’s just something that I personally wouldn’t want to do…I guess that I am just too much of a softy. I suppose that there isn’t much of a problem as long as taking off the stinger isn’t causing the Rays any excessive harm…

Posted by baitfish

It is supposed to be like clipping a fingernail, they are designed to break off, but it does leave the ray defenseless. Adam

Posted by tomaurand

If it bleeds, infection can set and kill the ray! Really no reason to cut the stinger. Has anybody on this board ever been stung by a ray???? Like being stuck by a catfish, it was probably the not the rays (or catfishes) fault.

Posted by baitfish

I have never cut them before, has anyone had them bleed from cutting them? However the size of the are of possible infection would be about the same size as the hole left by the hook. The material of the stinger is made of Keratin, the same material as your fingernail. If you were to clip it, I don’t see how it would bleed, but the popping method that neptune describes is different. You don’t really need to cut them off, if the ray is flipped onto it’s back, it presents little danger. Even then, keep your wits about you and safely return the ray to the water. Adam

Posted by neptune1234

The way I do it only takes a sec. Doesn’t leave any wounds. Just pops right off. Grab it near the base and bend it backwards. It’s almost surgical the way I do it. No harm done. I have yet to recatch an already de-stingered ray but I’M sure I will. The Monterey Bay Aquarium told me they grow back.

Posted by Leapin Bass

Yep… Last year while surf fishing. First – it is NOTHING like being stung by a catfish. I have lived through some pretty painful stuff (like my top lip being ripped in half-motorcycle accident) and I must say that the ray sting is at the top of the PAIN list. That freakin’ hurt more than I thought anything could hurt. I was doing Lamaz breathing on the way to the hospital. I don’t recommend it unless you like intense pain.
As for cutting the stingers off I’ve done it a few times when I was younger. There’s really no need to though. It does leave the ray defenseless until it grows back (if you cut it off correctly). The sad thing is that I’ve seen people cut the entire tail off – that sucks!

Posted by Red Fish

Couldn’t be like getting stung by a catfish I got stuck by a catfish when cleaning one as a kid and got part of the (stinger) lodged under the skin in my right index finger. It was similar to getting a splinter. Now I have never gotten stung by a bat ray but from what others have described that have been stung it sounds far worse than any catfish cut.

Posted by sharkshooter

Can you only get “stung” if the ray jabs you with the sharp end of the stinger, or is the whole thing dangerous? I’ve never gotten close enough to the business end to find out personally, nor do I care to. I always just flip them on their backs, pop the hook out, and scoot them back into the water to fight another day. but since some of you have already been stung, I may as well learn from it.

Posted by Ken Jones

In the past…I have recommended cutting off the stingers (not the tail) if anglers were concerned about handling the rays (for fear of getting stuck). I would much rather have the stinger cut off and see anglers handle the ray in a gentle manner than having it knocked around. However, I believe experienced anglers should be able to handle the rays safely without needing to cut the stinger off. As for harm to the fish, I have been told by several people who should know that there is no harm to the rays. The stingers are routinely cut off of the bat rays at the petting ponds at several aquariums. They grow back in about a month and are then cut off again. Sort of like cutting your hair. That way these creatures can be petted by our youngsters with little concern as to danger. The petting ponds are great, especially at MBA

Bat Ray caught at the 2007 Mud Marlin Derby at Berkeley Pier

Posted by Red Fish

Monterey Bay Aquarium. I think that visiting an aquarium should be a requirement for all novice saltwater anglers along with study regs prior to a license issue. I think it would avoid a great deal of the nonsense killing of sharks and rays by the uninformed.

Posted by Songslinger

The petting ponds are great, especially at MBA. So true. And a visit to the kelp forest exhibit is worth the price of admission.

Posted by gyozadude

That’s some awesome engineering. That tidal tank with the kelp forest rises and falls due to a pump that resembles an oil well pump. Very cool stuff at Monterey. Maybe we should do a PFIC outing there.

Posted by fishnchips

They can release the stinger during a fight (don’t even know if they grow back), but I can see some a*@hole doing that to render him defenseless to all of the other predators. Too bad for the bat, he’s probably not gonna live much longer. It’s lucky not to die from being cut up. People will often do that to crabs, but isn’t that more cruel, than just refusing to release the animal back into the water? Eat the mother up if you don’t want to run into it again! Survival of the fittest right?… not him now.. what a pity. Cut dudes hands off at the wrist and watch him get into a brawl…. not doin’ too good I bet….same idea! Sorry just rambling, I hate to hear of people being cruel to animals because of boredom!…. that’s why they call it fishin’ not catchin’…. good ol’ fishnchips!

Posted by gyozadude

Another source of damage… is getting cut up during the fight through entanglement. I used to fish braid for bat rays up through mid summer this year. But I started noticing the bright red lines where the braid had tangled with the ray and damaged the outside skin. In fact, some cuts were quite deep, and that really puts the ray at risk of infection or parasites. So I’ve switched back to 25-lb mono and thicker. It’s less likely to cut than the much thinner braid. While it’s stretches more and is quite thick, I think it’s still beneficial to stick with mono in this case. Of course, mono is also cheaper.

Posted by fishnchips

Good to know, didn’t think of that, especially dealing with bats! Thanks for the tip!
….that’s why they call it fishin’ not catchin’….good ol’ fishnchips!

Date: July 21, 2003
To: PFIC Message Board
From: batman
Subject: All those interested in BAT RAY Stings

Is it true that you can put vinegar or if it really hurts and you can’t wait that you can pee on a bat ray sting or is that jelly fish? I don’t want to pee on my self for the wrong kind of sting. Batman

Posted by pEsCaDoR619

Any kind of sting… you want to pour hot water (hotter the better) on it. This will break up the toxins and ease the pain. This is why they say to pee on it because fresh urine is very warm (no I’ve never been peed on). Breaking down the toxins will also lessen the chances of any delayed effects of it.

Posted by OB Pier Rat

And that works! I know first hand-I got whacked by a stingray just a month or two ago, followed your instructions and the pain was gone in about an hour…

Posted by Anotherbite

On the Gulf Coast, the treatment I have know my entire life for jellyfish stings is rubbing dry meat tenderizer on the affected area. It always worked pretty well when I tried it. Has anyone else heard of this method, and if so, would it work on the sting of a ray?

Posted by baitfish

From what I have read the poison in stingrays is protein based, so the hot water actually cooks the poison, and neutralizes it. As for urine, I was under the impression that it was the ammonia in Urine that made it effective, anybody have anything on this? Adam

Date: June 14, 2004
To: PFIC Message Board
From: RaidersFan1
Subject: Best way to pick up a Bat Ray or…..

A Shovelnose Skate? I’ve seen guys pick them by sticking their fingers into their eyes but this just doesn’t seem humane to me. Do they have teeth or would you recommend sticking your fingers into its mouth to hoist them up to get them over the railing? Any help would be a great education for me… Thanks in advance!! Mike RaidersFan1

Posted by pescare

Here’s a past tutorial from Gdude. — Hoisting rays by the mouth

Posted by gyozadude on March 4, 2003

I’ve never been bitten while hoisting a bat ray by its mouth. And while I’ve had a few rays try to chomp down on my hand, they don’t have teeth and it has never hurt. I only theorize that with all four fingers in their mouth, they really can’t chomp down effectively, and once you’ve got them in the air with all their body weight hanging, they really can’t do jack squat. So I’m just wondering if I’ve just been lucky, or if lifting by the mouth really is the proper hold. I have read that they can crush mussels, clams, and other mollusks so use the hand hold at your own risk.
I’ve seen people lift rays using a net, or by two hands, one in each nostril. But both ways can cause lacerations, especially on the big rays. Plus, it’s messy. I don’t know if you’ve ever gotten bat ray snot on your hands. The stuff is really viscous and it stinks. Not that I really mind while fishing, but if you’ve gotta go home and hug your babies, this ain’t exactly stuff the spouse would approve of getting all over the kids. I’ve wiped my hands off on dry rags and then put them through the wash twice with hot water and extra detergent and still, the slime isn’t completely dissolved. So I really like the mouth hold because it’s a lot cleaner.

Technique is pretty easy. With palm facing up, just reach down under and slip your hand into the mouth and curl your fingers up. You should feel the tips of your fingers curl in and stop against the roof of the mouth. Then hoist quickly, and you’ve got it.

Posted by newgen

Wow what a picture! I think that I will use that hold on them, it seems more natural, and less harmful to their bodies than any other hold.

Posted by prometheus

By the mouth is the only effective way to pick up big rays with one hand since their nostrils are too far apart. Watch out for your hook though!

Bat Ray caught at the Mud Marlin Derby at Berkeley Pier in 2015

Posted by pEsCaDoR619

I wouldn’t try it on a big shovelnose. I did that with a 4-footer once and got the chomping of a lifetime. No teeth, just sandpaper-like cartilage for lips. But that sucker had some power in them jaws. I hurt for a good couple hours.

Posted by gyozadude

Spent four years washing dishes. LOL! One way to toughen up the hands is to wash dishes. I did that for four years during high school and early college and grew some thick skin! LOL! Seriously, if you’re afraid of the chomp, you can get some leather gardening gloves from Home Depot for a buck and that really protects the fingers. The key trick is assertiveness. You don’t want to second guess the ray and wonder if he’s gonna bite you. You just gotta stick your hand in there and grab it firm and hoist. If you dally too long, the ray might get the idea that it’s got “finger food” in its mouth and chomp down or thrash. I don’t think the chomp is all that heavy. The ray has mostly smooth plates inside its mouth and a couple of rows of ridges for teeth. If it chomps down, the ridges really can’t cut you, but if the ray flaps around and you loosen your grip, that’s where the ridges might slip and pinch you in the knuckles. So the key is to assert yourself, be quick, and be firm. Once hoisted, it’s like a bass with a hyper-extended lower jaw – pretty much paralyzed and cooperative

Posted by sharkshooter

Yeah – I’m familiar with the slime. Part of the reason I’m thinking about picking them up by the mouth, besides not wanting to damage them. pescador’s post makes me think twice about it, though…

Posted by prometheus

He’s just warning you not to try it with any shovelnose sharks, or skates for that matter. They both have teeth.

Posted by sharkshooter

Hmmm… I thought he was saying it was the power of the bite, and not the sandpaper lips that hurt. I guess I’ll try it with a glove first, and check for bite marks. Or I’ll just have raysniper do it first. He’ll do anything this board tells him to do.

Posted by lucy

Based on pics I’ve seen of the construction of a bat ray’s mouth, I believe you’re actually picking them up by what would, on a human, be the upper lip. The “plates” they use to crush oyster and other shells are actually farther inside the mouth, and unless you stick your fingers in there, you’re in no danger of being hurt because they can’t “chomp” with their lips.
I could be wrong about this, so don’t anybody rely on this—and if you do, don’t blame me if you lose some fingers.

Bat Ray logo by Lucy Phillips, 2004

Posted by andthelinegoeszziipp

Watch the stinger on the real small rays while gripping them by the mouths. They can actually curl their lower bodies and sting like a scorpions tail.

Date: March 14, 2005
TO: PFIC Message Board
From: Ken Jones
Subject: Seal Beach and stingrays —

“A quarter of all stingray-related injuries reported in the United States occur at little tiny Seal Beach,” says Lowe. “For locals who have lived here for a long time, it’s commonly called Ray Bay.”
Forget Sharks, Watch Out for Stingrays, Jellies
July 23, 2002
Release from:
LONG BEACH, California, July 23, 2002 (ENS)
The greatest threats to California beachgoers in these warm months are jellyfish and stingrays. Sharks are a distant third, says Dr. Christopher Lowe, assistant professor of biological sciences at California State University, Long Beach.
A marine biologist, Lowe specializes in elasmobranchs – sharks, skates and rays – as well as game fishes. He says these sea creatures often move closer to shore during warmer months.
Jellyfish pose particular problems because they can be hard to see. “They get stirred up in the waves and the person gets stung and never sees the jellyfish,” says Lowe. “Generally, its sting is characterized by a light, tingly sensation that gradually builds into a burning sensation that tends to be localized where the tentacles make contact with the person’s skin.”
Jellies “can have tentacles that can be very, very long – 30 to 40 feet when they’re extended – so a person can be swimming along, get stung by a tentacle and never actually see the jellyfish,” explained Lowe.
As for treatment, “Often when people get stung, they have a tendency to rub their skin, and quite often when they do that, they just smear the tentacle over more of their skin surface. If you see the jellyfish, the best thing to do is to try to gently grab the tentacle – ideally with something other than fingers – lift it off and flick it away. People recommend trying to use a credit card or piece of cardboard to scrape it off without smearing it over the skin,” Lowe said.
Because the toxin is topical, vinegar is a good treatment, Lowe recommends. “You can use ammonia as well as Adolph’s Meat Tenderizer. These will neutralize the toxin and take away the burn,” he says.
Getting stung by a ray is a more serious matter, especially if encountering a congregation of them. During the summer, stingrays move inshore and are most commonly found in estuaries, bays and along calm sand beaches, Lowe explains. “So the most likely places people encounter them would be if they were swimming at a bay beach or along a calm, sandy, muddy shoreline. They can aggregate in very, very large densities.”
When stepped on, a stingray whips up its long, barb-tipped tail.
“A quarter of all stingray-related injuries reported in the United States occur at little tiny Seal Beach,” says Lowe. “For locals who have lived here for a long time, it’s commonly called Ray Bay.”
Lowe researches the reasons for the high stingray population at Seal Beach. It may result from the breakwater off the Long Beach coast, which reduces shoreline wave action from around Seal Beach to San Pedro.
The San Gabriel River has several power plants that dump warm water effluent into that river, and that warms the water at Seal Beach, making it attractive for these rays, Lowe says.
Development of many of our bays and estuaries into marinas has reduced the natural habitat for the four types of stingrays found along California’s nearshore – diamond ray, round ray, butterfly ray and bat ray.
“So what we’ve done at Seal Beach,” Lowe says, “is, that through urban development, we’ve created a super habitat for some of these stingrays, and unfortunately, it just happens to be the same super habitat that humans like to go surf and swim and play in.”
‘In summer, we believe the rays are coming in to mate, and later in the summer, females are probably giving birth to their pups; rays give birth to live young,” said Lowe.
“The females might be staying in the warm water to speed up their gestation rate so their pups will develop faster. So the places where people are most likely to encounter them are when they’re walking around a shallow bay area through water that might only be a meter deep.”
The best way to avoid getting stung is to do what Lowe calls the “stingray shuffle” sliding one’s feet through the sand and under a ray. This will generally cause it to swim away without lashing its tail.
Stingrays are found right in the surf, and they also congregate just beyond the breakers. “A lot depends on the surf,” said Lowe. At places with milder waves, “we found stingrays right into the surf zone. By having that flat body, they kind of stick to the bottom and don’t get tumbled around. But that’s right in the place where people can’t see very well and as they’re walking through, that’s probably when they’ll accidentally step on one. But once you’re just beyond that zone is where we tend to find the greatest densities.”
Unlike the gradual sting of a jellyfish, “As soon as somebody gets stung, they’re going to know it, because it’s a barb that actually penetrates the skin and creates a wound,” said Lowe.
“Something has actually poked into your skin and there is mucus that covers the barb. Embedded in that mucus covering are toxin cells, so as the barb punctures the skin, it causes those cells to rupture and the toxin leaches into the individual’s skin,” is how he explained the pain.
“The first thing the individual should do when they’re stung is to do their shuffle back out of the water and try not to get stung again,” Lowe advises, “because quite often people hobble and when they do that, they take the chance of being stung again. You’ve got to think of it like going through a minefield. These animals are very social and tend to congregate. People ought to try to go back out the way they came in.”
“The general treatment is, first of all, make sure the wound is clean,” he said. “They should make sure the barb is no longer in there. The little barbs allow it to get wedged in, but when it pulls out, it pulls out a little bit of flesh and that helps rupture those toxin cells.”
In rare case, if the puncture is deep, the spine will actually pull out of the ray and get embedded in the individual’s skin. Then a medical doctor should remove it.
“In most cases it’s just maybe a quarter of an inch or smaller that penetrates the skin – just a quick poke is all it takes. It’s extremely painful. It’s not uncommon to see the toughest surfer dude weeping,” Lowe observed.
“As long as it’s clean and there are no bits of spine left in there, the best treatment is hot water – as hot as they can stand it. That helps denature the toxin. The general treatment should last an hour or more.”
For any type of beach injury, it’s best to seek medical attention from lifeguards who have the necessary training and equipment. The greatest concern is for individuals with severe allergies to stings. “Those people can go into anaphylactic shock and that’s why for some people, getting treatment right away is important,” said Lowe.
He advises such people to carry their anti-sting epinephrine medication. “It’s something people don’t think of taking to the beach.”
Lowe and his team of student researchers have been involved in discovering ways to help reduce stingray injuries. “In Seal Beach, the city has been looking at ways of reducing injuries to the public, and they’ve tried everything from eradication to translocation – trying to move as many as they could.”
Since none of these efforts were successful, or were considered to be ecologically reasonable, Lowe proposed a stingray barb-clipping program. “The barb is similar to a fingernail; it’s basically a modified scale,” Lowe said. “It doesn’t have any nerves leading to it, so you can clip off the pointy end.”
But after two years of clipping the barbs of about 2,000 stingrays, Lowe and his student team found that these rays replace their spines every late summer to early fall. A new spine grows in, the original spine falls off, so at no point are these rays really without a spine.
Lowe has concluded that the barb-clipping technique will not work at the scale that they were doing it. He now believes that “the answer is better education.”
For more information on Lowe’s research, visit: http://www.csulb.edu/web/labs/sharklab

Round Stingray caught at the Crystal Pier in San Diego by Mike Granat 

Posted by FakeFisherman

That’s where I got my sting…Seal Beach, except I caught the stingray off the pier and got stung trying to handle it. I’m sure the stings would be much worse if you were in the water and actually stepped on one.
There’s a funny story here, too. As I was taking pictures of the wound, a couple was walking on the pier and came over to see what kind of weirdo was taking pictures of his own bloody hand. I told them that I just got stung by a stingray, and apparently they had a friend who’d also been stung recently. The husband said, “You can put some steak sauce on it and it should feel better.” I wasn’t sure if he was serious or not, so I kind of smiled and said, “ahhh.” Then the wife looked at him quizzically and quipped, “Not steak sauce…MEAT TENDERIZER!” We all had a good laugh after that.
FYI the wound was only about 1/4″ wide, but it was a little bit deeper than 1/4″ and was on the meaty side of my hand (pinky side). The stingray itself was no more than about 10” across.
The initial sting was obvious. Within 10 minutes it was annoying. After 30 mins it was hot, and the pain had spread through to my pinky. After an hour, half my hand – including the pinky and ring finger was extremely numb and the pain was pretty sharp. In two hours it was difficult to close those fingers. I’m probably stupid for doing this, but I never really took care of it and wanted to see what would happen with this sting.
During the next four weeks or so, the side of my hand was extremely hard and swollen, and sometime bluish. I would occasionally squeeze some fluid from the wound, but when I did this the swelling would increase over the next couple days. I was probably spreading around whatever toxin was still in my hand. It remained hard and distended and sometimes sensitive through about the 6th week, and then everything kind of went away. I still have a tiny scar to show for it.
Lesson: If you get stung, use meat tenderizer…NOT steak sauce!-Matty

Posted by jph

That’s where I got my sting…that must have been a baby bat ray that stung you, and still it sounds like it did quite a bit of damage. I wonder what one of those big guys can do?
anyway, I think my first reaction would be to suck the wound and spit out whatever comes out if it’s in a location that allows this.

Date: October 7, 2005
To: PFIC Message Board
From: Mr. Pole Pack
Subject: Question about stingers…

Anyone who’s been to the Monterey Bay Aquarium knows they have a bat ray petting tank. Last time I was there, I checked to see if their stingers were removed. They weren’t. Does this kiddy petting pool prove the stingers aren’t too dangerous? I’ve never seen some one get hurt by a ray’s stinger while it was on its back on land.

Posted by wang

I was told they cut them off (or down). I volunteered at the Aquarium of the Pacific for about a year. I was told the stingers are cut every 2-3 months. The stingers on ray are like fingernails, they grow back. The only downfall is, if they loose their stinger, that they are defenseless until it grows back. The tails doesn’t grow back if they are cut off.

Posted by eelmaster

The stingers WERE removed last time I was there.

Posted by geese

I would imagine it to be like a scorpion sting, or perhaps I may be wrong, it might be much more painful! Don’t want to find out.

Posted by Clayman

Have you looked at the size of those stingers on bat rays? They’re huge, and covered with slime. I’ve never been stung by a scorpion, but I’m sure a sting by a bat ray would REALLY hurt, and it would probably get all infected real fast. For sharp stingers, it’s hard to beat the two spines on spiny dogfish. Now those things are big AND sharp!

Posted by stripesidechaser

BTW, that isn’t slime on the stinger! That is actually a skin covered poison filled pod. The affects the nerve endings and causes intense pain (as if a 4″ long, 1/4″ wide barbed spear isn’t painful enough). When they stab an object, some of that “pod” breaks off inside (unlike RH’s buddy, most of the time the sting comes back out). I saw an extremely drunk guy get stung in the calve… That dude went sober!

Posted by q3fishboy

The Monterey Bay Aquarium does clip the stingers off of all the bat rays and stingrays that may be touched on display. As previously stated, the stingers are similar to our fingernails, and are actually made from the same protein. I have heard that the Monterey Bay Aquarium will catch bat rays, cut off the stinger, and put them in the touch tank. After the stingers begin to grow back, they will put them in a different tank where they cannot be touched. Finally, after the stinger is completely regrown, they will return the bat rays to the wild. I do not know if this cycle is true, because before the upgrade to the tank, I could actually recognize all of the rays in there individually. Though they have all changed since the upgrade, I don’t know if that actually cycle them regularly. However, they do clip the stingers off.
If you go to the Sharks Mystery and Myth touch tank and look at the round sting rays, it is much more noticeable and you can see exactly where the stinger used to be, as there is a small depression in the tail. However, the spines on the horn shark are a different structure, and do not grow back, so the Monterey Bay Aquarium does not trim them. However, they do have horn sharks in the touch tank in Sharks Mystery and Myth. So, they attempted to take a nail file and file the spines so they were not as sharp, which kind of worked.
Sorry about the long post, but I have spent way too much time at the Monterey Bay Aquarium, and though I have no official affiliation with the place, I really love it.

Bat Ray caught at Tides Wharf in Bodega Bay, 2004

Posted by outtosea2

I know a lot of people post BAT RAY pix here on the message board and hopefully most of them are returned to the water, much like one of my past 170# plus MAMMA BAT RAY that was returned unharmed to give birth.
What really irritates me is when ignorant people keep cutting off and mutilating the STINGERS and TAILS of these great fighters, just to throw them back into the sea to DIE later. I once hassled a jerk on NP PIER as to his cutting these STINGERS off only to put another one in his little glass “BRAGGING” collection jar.
TROPHY JAR, I think NOT!!
STUPIDITY JAR, YES!!
After we all got on his case and made him look like an idiot in front of all the people crowds he attracted I think he finally got the message he wasn’t wanted there, and never has come back to my knowledge!!
Many BAT RAYS are left TOO LONG on the HOT CONCRETE PIER DECK to cook inside and or suffer organ damage from their excessive body weight on them, as they are a fish out of water once brought ashore, or taken out of their water element. In the water they are virtually weightless! I’ve seen many a dead BAT RAY under the piers while scuba diving to know!!
Eating them is one thing as a food source if they are big enough, as there is no size limit, bag limit, or species restrictions of any kind on them, and maybe there should be. A BABY KILLER is a bay killer by any means, all restrictions set aside. Hope my input sheds some different light on these often misunderstood yet magnificent fighters of the deep blue sea! Happy fishing, Frank

Posted by Ken Jones

Stingrays do not “attack” aggressively, or even actively defend themselves, when threatened their primary reaction is to swim away. However, when they are attacked by predators or stepped on, the barbed stinger in their tail is mechanically whipped up, usually into the offending foot; it is also possible, although less likely, to be stung “accidentally” by brushing against the stinger.
Contact with the stinger causes local trauma (from the cut itself), pain and swelling from the venom, and possible infection from parts of the stinger left in the wound, as well as from seawater entering the wound. It is possible for ray stings to be fatal if they sever major arteries, are in the chest or pelvic region, or are improperly treated. Their stingers are normally ineffective against their main predator, sharks.
Treatment for stings includes hot water (as hot as the victim can stand), which helps ease pain and break down the venom, and antibiotics. Vinegar or urine may or may not be successful in easing pain; neither cleans the wound properly. Other possible pain remedies include meat tenderizer. Pain normally lasts up to 48 hours but is most severe in the first 30-60 minutes and may be accompanied by nausea, fatigue, headaches, chills, etc.

Posted by CatchinKelp, October 13, 2010

Bat rays are the friendliest fish on earth, it is true. That is why I have a hard time imagining taking and eating one. It’s like… eating my dog or something… :p

Posted by clayman

The big rays have always reminded me of big cows, the way they make all kinds of slurping/snorting noises when on land. Even though I find them somewhat annoying when I’m targeting other species, I wouldn’t have the heart to kill one.

The correct way to hold a Bat Ray — caught at the Green Pleasure Pier in Avalon by Rita Magdamo in 2011

Link: http://www.tropicalleather.com/Biology-of-stingray

Date: May 21, 2013 — To: PFIC Message Board — From: Illcatchanything2 — Subject: Mud Marlin Derby Report

We had great weather and a good turnout for our 12th annual MMD. We had 62 registered participants. A total of 12 Rays hit the deck during the derby.  Three rays were landed in the first hour, including the eventual winner that weighed in at 88#’s. The others were landed sporadically with another flurry of action coming in the last hour and a half. The 2nd place winner was landed during this time period, weighing in at 64#’s.

The winners for the derby were: 1st place: Wong Xiong- 88#, 47″ wingspan  — 2nd place: Damon Knudson- 64#, 43″ wingspan (very pregnant —3rd place: Steven Koh- 37#, 31″ wingspan

As usual there was plenty of food that was brought to share. A big thank you to all who brought dishes for the potluck. I want to give a big thank you to all who came out and participated. Without your support, the MMD would not be going strong after 12 years

Posted by Salty Nick v2 — Sounds like a nice derby – finally, the rays made a good showing. Salty

The logo not used — 2nd place among voters

 OH NO! — When you try to do something good…

Posted by Sofa King on May 20, 2013 — We Have a Problem:  Saturday when I went to Castro Valley Sportsman’s Center to pick up the raffle prizes they had so kindly donated to the Mud Marlin Derby so Pier Fishing In California could raise a bit of monies to help with our groups expenses, “Somebody” had “Volunteered“ to bring the prizes to the derby for me.

The owner of the Castro Valley Sportsmen’s Center gave this “Somebody” the prizes not knowing them or realizing that I was the only one supposed to pick them up. This “Somebody” was gearing up for the derby and said that they were going to the P.F.I.C. M.M.D., that that they had room in their car and could drop off the prizes for us.

When I arrived, the owner of Castro Valley Sportsmen’s Center was a bit surprised because she had given the prizes to this “Somebody” and was not expecting me. After explaining that I was the only one of our group that was authorized to pick up the prizes she was shocked that she may have made a mistake.

Since we were unsure of this “Somebody’s” intent, Castro Valley Sportsmen’s Center gave me an extra “set” of donation items. Just in case if “Somebody” ran into issues and was unable to actually make the derby.

Needless to say, “SOMEBODY” DID NOT SHOW UP AND DELIVER the prizes as promised. While we understand that things in life can happen, these prizes really should be returned. No questions asked or explanations necessary. Just drop the prizes back off at the Castro Valley Sportsmen’s Center, or send me or Illcatchanything2 a pm and we can arrange a pickup. Let’s not let this taint our relationship with Castro Valley Sportsmen’s Center.

Side note, Please show your support of our resources and stop into Castro Valley Sportsmen’s Center when you need to gear up. They will beat anybody else’s price, including EBay. It’s a great shop and if they don’t already have it they can order it for you. Don’t forget to mention your handle on PFIC.  

Posted by bigunindaboat — File a sheriffs report, was it enough to be grand theft? I hope this was a mistake, but if not stealing from a group like PFIC is a really crappy thing to do.

Posted by McCMSchultz — Oh NO! F*#$ING UNBELIEVABLE! Who wudda thunk? I hope the merchandise is returned. Picture I.D. next time, Hans. (But doesn’t necessarily mean that it was a member either…… Has it really come to this?????

Posted by fish4s2na — Unfortunately, I can believe this happening in this day and age. Hopefully, this was simply a misunderstanding and not someone out to pull a fast one. Pretty scuzzy and low life if it was!

Posted by KAHUNA — If you know who it is, file a police report ASAP. This is unacceptable for a grown man to act this way. It’s dishonorable and cowardly.

Posted by Ken Jones — How did “somebody” know they were donating prizes to us to be picked up? I’m not surprised there are people out there who would do such a thing but it sounds like it would have to be someone familiar with the situation. No description of the person?

Posted by Red Fish — Post from SK from March 29, 2013 — Castro Valley Sportsmen’s Center has graciously offered some donations for our upcoming Mud Marlin Derby and Kids Derbies. In return they also offer discounts to PFIC members who mention their PFIC handle. Not including licenses etc. Suppose your local small business and they will help support you. Please bring them your business for all your fishing needs.

Posted by Sofa King — The owner of Castro Valley Sportsmen’s Center believes she mentioned that I was on my way to pick up the raffle items to a customer she was helping. This person had hooks weights and squid and said they were on the way to Berkeley pier for the derby. And the next person, “Somebody”, also had similar gear for purchase and mentioned they too were headed to the derby and would be happy to bring the items for us.  She believes this person must have overheard her and saw an opportunity.

Posted by Redkorn — Was there CC camera footage? May help with ID.

Posted by thefrood — I just can’t understand people like that. Something wrong inside their heads… simply unacceptable behavior. I think Redkorn has a good idea with the CC footage… if we can get it posted around and also alert other tackle shops (are there many left around here?) about this person then they will be forewarned.

Posted by dkkim — What’s up with the “Somebody” comments. Are you giving them a chance to fess up because you know them? Just report it or ask the store to report it. If you do know who it is, then let us know so we don’t associate with the loser.

Posted by Illcatchanything2 — The term “somebody” was put in because we DO NOT know who it was and the only description that the owner was able to give was so vague that it could apply to 90% of fishermen. As for future donations from Castro Valley Sportsmen’s Center, it has been made clear that SK is the only one that will pick things up (unless he introduces another person). We also know what was being donated so we are keeping an eye on Craigslist.

Sadly, this kind of thing happens, and there are people out there who will take advantage of any situation… As was mentioned, lets give Castro Valley Sportsmen’s Center some business and send your buddies there as well. They went above and beyond by replacing the items that were taken.

Again if this is a mistake and someone here did pick the items up with the intention of coming to the MMD and dropping them off but was not able to make it for whatever reason, then PM SofaKing or Myself and we will arrange to pick them up and return them. ICA2

[We are currently trying to find any pictures people may have of this event.]

]]> http://kenjonesfishing.com/2018/04/2013-pficupsac-mud-marlin-derby-berkeley-pier/feed/ 0 http://kenjonesfishing.com/2018/04/2009-pficupsac-mud-marlin-derby-2-berkeley-pier/ http://kenjonesfishing.com/2018/04/2009-pficupsac-mud-marlin-derby-2-berkeley-pier/#comments Tue, 03 Apr 2018 17:08:11 +0000 kenjones http://kenjonesfishing.com/?p=19419 The 2009 Mud Marlin Derby was scheduled and held on April 4, 2009. However, no mud marlin (bat rays) were caught so the “pier rats” called for a second derby. In response, a second derby was held on August 1 of that year — with better results.

Berkeley Pier before the crowd!

Date: August 2, 2009 — To: PFIC Message Board — From: illcatchanything2 — Subject: MMD

Red has already posted a lot of pics, and more will be on the way from other cameras, but here is a short narrative (from my perspective).

illcatchanything2 (Brian)

I arrived at the pier around 3:30pm with my son (fishinggamer) and Bigrich. Redfish, Minnowmagent, Sharkslayer and a few others were already on the pier. After unpacking all the stuff, I set up a light pole with a bobber rig and a live smelt (thanks to Redfish who had been working his cast net with great results). I continued setting up for the derby while watching my pole. Had a huge take down, but by the time I got to my pole the fish had dropped the bait. Pulled in and looked forlornly at the tell tale teeth marks on my smelt.

Brian

I threw a new bait back out and continued to set up. 6:00pm arrived, and out came the big poles for the Rays. Mingled for a little bit meeting some new people and some old, then….

Uncle Dale strikes first blood with an 8# ray around 6:30. Measured, weighed and released and back to the table.

Got the stove going and proceed to cook some Hot Links that were graciously donated by West Coast Dave and crew, and then started on the fish I had brought — Leopard Shark, 7-Gill, and Shovelnose Guitarfish. A Lingcod followed, as well as some coffee.

Brian cooking

In what seemed like a few minutes, it was 9:00pm. No more rays had been caught, but a few baby soupfins had been landed. Then Redfish lands a 4-foot (or so) soupfin. I had never had soupfin, so back to the table it went. Bled, filleted and cut into chunks it went on the stove much to my delight (since it was really good). 10:30 now and still no more rays. Determined to give away the trophies, Redfish and I started making back up plans to include the sharks in the Derby. So with that in mind, we fished on…

One of the sharks

At 11:40 it looked like Uncle Dale would take 1st with the only ray, while Davey (I think) a guest of a member (can’t remember who) would take 2nd with a 2-foot soupfin and Frank (a guest of Minnowmagent) would take 3rd with another soupy. Then Jesus (another guest) went into 2nd place with another soupy.

At 11:50 we were getting the trophies ready to give out and all of a sudden Michael (can’t remember your board name) gets a nice ray bite. A nice fight later and he was in the lead with an 18#, 31″ ray. Looks like that would be it and then… 11:56 and Frank (minnow’s guest) gets a nice run. He fights it and up comes another ray. Just by eyeballing, I knew it would be close. Weighed and it comes it at 18# (a tie with Michael) the tape would now tell the tale… Taped it out and it comes in at 34 3/4… Franks ray was landed at 12:05.

So the trophies and eternal glory went to: 1st Place- Frank with his 34 3/4″ ray — 2nd Place- Michael with his 31″ ray — 3rd Place- Uncle Dale with the 8# (24″) ray.

Front — Red fish (Robert Gardner) and Illcatchanything2 (Brian Linebarger) — Trophy Winners (L to R) — Michael, Frank and Uncle Dale 

It was a great event with an exciting finish. 1st & 2nd place landed in the last nine minutes of the derby. It was great meeting everyone new and seeing some the people who I have not seen since the last MMD. Also, it was great to meet Bat Ray Dave who represented our SoCal members. This is the first time since I have been attending the MMD’s (and maybe the first time period, some older members will have to correct me if I am wrong) that we have had a SoCal member at the MMD. Hope the trend continues and we get more next year.

Frank (Mr. Twister) and 1st Place Trophy

Another one in the books, I packed up all my stuff (with the much appreciated help of Sharkslayer & Big Rich) and made the long walk to the car.

Michael and 2nd Place Trophy

Had a great time as usual. Thanks to everyone who made it out and helped make this a great event!!

Uncle Dave and Third Place Trophy

Date: April 5, 2009 —To: PFIC Message Board — From: Posted by gyozadude — Subject: Mud Marlin Derby

MMGT 2009, as you have heard now, was a bust for the rays.  But food was awesome.  Brian (IllCatchAnything) made homemade chili (excellent!) and fried halibut. How do folks get any fresher?  I think Robert caught it just earlier, before the start, and before sundown, it was sliced into fillets and breaded.  Then fried on the pier.  Wow!

I made cheese steak sandwiches, hotlinks, and vegetable beef soup.  I sure left a LOT lighter than when I came in.  That went fast too, as did a 30 pack of Danishes.

I left trophies with Red, and the plan is to wait a little, then have part 2 of the MMGT and this time get some rays.

The raffle went well for the limited folks that came in. Roster puts us at 50 official participants plus four unregistered that showed up last minute because they heard about it, however, I did not allow them to enter into the contest for the trophies. Total take was for $245, deposited today at WaMu/Chase. Top raffle prize went to kid who arrived at the MMGT with Dad and felt under powered on his rod.  Not anymore. He’s got a 10ft heaver with magged Jigmaster now that can actually power cast 6+ oz.

Robert, that hali was simply delicious!  Gotta give Brian kudos too.  Who was the new board guy that served as judge at the end?  He’s a former rocket sci kinda dude too.  Way cool.  Anyways, the best thing is we’re gonna do this again .

A bit windy in the late afternoon and early evening. Some old and new faces of participants.

Brian “the chef” (IllCookAnything2) — “catch” that is. What a fantastic job on the chili and the halibut. Full service! He and his son were there at the event.

Dan fought valiantly, but the gangster ray eluded him by swimming under the pier and cutting the line around the abrasive pilings. Others on the starboard side of the pier could have been more helpful by bringing in their rigs sooner. But alas, that’s all part of the contest!

Posted by mel — And the winner is…. (drum roll)………No one! No kidding! Bat-Ray-Dave wrote: No runs, hits, or errors?? Are you saying the Rays pitched a shutout? If so, demand a rematch and make it a 1st or 2nd Saturday of the month later this year and I will show up and make the long trek up there.

No, we had a few hits and runs…. Just no landings. Red Fish caught a halibut (again), and graciously donated it for the fish fry. Everyone did have a great time though, with lots of food to go around. Thanks to Gdude for the awesome cheesesteak sandwiches and everything else. Thanks to all who made the long trek out there and stuck it out. We talked last night about have part two, so we will take you up on your offer Dave…

Posted by red fish — Yeah… I had a good time too. As I mentioned to some, ‘you would have thought it was a sturgeon derby’ with the intense concentration of the anglers and scarcity of bites. Seems like enough are interested in a rematch so we will have to book a future date. It would be great if Dave could travel down for the battle. Thanks to all that participated and those that volunteered their time as judges. The weather was favorable, the fish, uncooperative, the event, enjoyable. Special thanks to James Gyozadude and Brian Illcatchanything for their tremendous effort in coordinating the activities of this event and making this event comfortable for all. Thanks for all of your donations of time and goods to make the event a success for all. Nice documentation Phil of the only bat ray fight of the evening for the derby, as, I wasn’t able to witness it from the section of the pier I was located closer to the last cleaning sink. It paints a picture for those who have never fished or been to Berkeley Pier (I’m surprised you didn’t slip in the requisite shot of the Golden Gate Bridge from the pier perspective).

Illcatchanything (Brian) cooking

Posted by itsakeeper — Awesome video northern boy. Even with the lack of show of Mr. Bat Ray, I still had a wonderful time hanging out with the PFIC crew. Thanks once again to James, Bryan, and others for setting this up for the rest of us to enjoy. Thanks also to red fish for donating his freshly caught halibut and leopard shark. That was a nice treat. The chili, Philly steak and soup was so good. It was nice meeting new folks and being around with old and new friends. I hope that there will be another great get together soon.

GDude in front, Brian in the back

]]> http://kenjonesfishing.com/2018/04/2009-pficupsac-mud-marlin-derby-1-berkeley-pier/feed/ 0 http://kenjonesfishing.com/2018/04/2010-pficupsac-mud-marlin-derby-berkeley-pier/ http://kenjonesfishing.com/2018/04/2010-pficupsac-mud-marlin-derby-berkeley-pier/#comments Tue, 03 Apr 2018 04:51:57 +0000 kenjones http://kenjonesfishing.com/?p=18948 2010 Mud Marlin Logo — 1st among voters

Date: May 16, 2010 — To: PFIC Message Board — From: Illcatchanything — Subject: Mud Marlin Derby 2010

We had a great time at the 9th Annual MMD, with food, friends, fun & FISH!! The derby started out a little slow, then around 8:30pm, the bite turned on with rays landed at 8:30, 8:40, 8:42 & 8:50. Things slowed down a bit after that, but picked up again around 10:00 with rays landed at 10:05, 10:18, & 10:35. Going into the final hour we thought that the bite had died, but a flurry of action finished the night off with rays landed at 11:50, 11:52, and 11:58. So we had 10 rays landed for the derby participants, along with some other fish including a legal leopard shark that was donated for the frying pan and a baby 7-gill. Not a bad night of fishing!n We had a good turn out for a cold and windy night with 63 people signing the register

2010 Logo not used 

Our winners were: 1st Place: Redfish with a 49 1/2″ fish — 2nd Place: Tyrell Davis (guest of Fish Addict 707) with a 46″ fish — 3rd Place: Richard (sorry I couldn’t read your last name), a guest of West Coast Dave with a 40” fish.

It was a blast seeing some old friends and meeting new ones. Thanks to everyone who came out and braved the cold and wind. PS- I forgot to bring my camera, so I will be relying on Sofa King, Redfish and anyone else who took pics to post them up…..

Posted by Bat Ray Dave — That’s great! Does Red have the all time tournament record now?

Posted by pierhead — I guess I’m being a bit of a smart a** but you forgot your camera again? Two events in a row? Nonetheless, thanks for the report. Sorry Mary and I couldn’t be there but we’re just a bit too old for an all nighter. Congrats to the winners and everyone that participated. It’s great that you and others like you are willing to donate their time and effort to putting on these events.

2010 Logo not used

Posted by sofa king — Had a blast last night. Everybody I came with and that met me out there want to do it again. Congrats to the winners. It was great seeing my fellow fisherman friends again and meeting new ones. I think we should do this more often. I did bring a camera and I have q bunch of pics I took but my comp is choking on ‘em. “Old comp”. Anybody want to resize them for me and post them? Send me a pm with your e-mail and I’ll send them to you in the am. Thanks. [Pictures were posted but inaccessible]

Posted by t177 — Thanks Brian for putting together another awesome event. Although it was so cold that my nose kept on running, the food kept me going for the night. The chili and fried striper/leo were so good. The hot cup of coffee hit the spot when the wind was blowing. I had fun although I got skunked and I didn’t win anything from the ruffle. Actually, I was so busy helping Robert land his ray that I didn’t even know the ruffle was going on!

Posted by mandre800 — Here are pics of the ray I landed and the 54″ Leopard Shark I donated to the frying pan.

Mud Marlin = Bat Ray

Leopard Shark

Luckily the storm seemed to abate somewhat and my friend Mike and I hopped out of the car and began to unload the equipment. First the rods and reels, then the pier cart, the bait cooler, misc. bucket, small cooler, and tackle box.

About that time three fishermen walked by, all equipped with pier carts and a variety of rods and reels, nets, buckets and “necessary” accouterments. True “pier rats” who knew the needs of those who seek the big ‘butts, stripers, sharks and rays from California’s longest pier (and the first WCB pier in the state). No way you’re hand carrying all that tackle out to the end of the 3,000+ foot-long-pier!

Illcatchanything (Brian Linebarger) setting up for the cooking

“How was the fishing” was the question and the “regulars” said,  “wet.” But seven legal halibut was the report on the pier, one a nice fish of 45”, and about 12-13 striped bass. Not great fishing but also not bad, but the time of the day and the rain had taken its toll; it was time for them to leave.

Brian

Mike and I headed out to the pier where we stopped for a short visit at the restroom. While there, the rain began anew. Mike headed back to the car while I continued out to the third cleaning station and the gathering.

Mike Granat

The crowd at that time was approximately 30-35 people but it would grow and see an eventual group of 62 people. Included were a mix of long time PFIC regulars together with some newbies. At the main table were Brian (Illcatchanything2) and Hans (Sofa King) while nearby saw some oldies but goodies—Robert (Redfish), MikeJonesJr, and West Coast Dave (from Sacramento). Sitting by a tent were Bob (Side Stripe Chaser) and his wife Kim, next to them was Big Rich. Two poles away were Matt Shockley and a group he had brought down from Reno for the event. Peter (surf samurai) and V were there as was Phishnpat, Fin Prints and The Orion. Eventually James (GDude) would show up with his son Warren. Others, and I didn’t get all the names, were there and as said, the group would grow.

GDude — James Liu

To make a long story short, I had a great time even though I didn’t land any bat rays and though I was very, very cold. I did get to witness a great fight between Kim and a 49-pound bat ray, a fight that including crossed lines and bait buckets. People helped her out and made sure she was able to land a nice fish. They then made sure the fish was returned safely to the water. Soon after Bob landed a small bat ray but that was the extent of fish fights for me. My buddy Mike was freezing and asked if I minded leaving early and since I too was cold I said that it was OK. I would have liked to have been able to stay but had had the chance to meet everyone (I hope) and share a least a few hours at the pier.

Warren Liu

Mike and I headed back to the car at 9PM while Brian, Hans and James continued on with the derby, awards and raffle. I’ll have to leave the fuller report of this derby to Brian, Hans and Robert.

The number of caught mud marlin (bat rays) was low but this happy lady angler got one of them

Berkeley’s Master Angler Songslinger likes to say it’s all about the fish but I have to disagree. The Mud Marlin Derby is as much about the chance to see old friends, perhaps make a few new friends, and share a few hours in a sport we all love. For derbies such as this, and the Get Together at Catalina, the camaraderie of the group is as important as the fish.

I was TRYING to stay warm

Driving back to the motel in Oakland, Mike said he was amazed at the number of people at the event given the weather. He was also impressed at how the people worked together and the expertise evident in the group. Lastly, he was amazed at the equipment he saw at the event. Mike is a former Shimano representative, one who had the entire South American continent as his territory, and has seen and still has a lot of equipment. Like many he knew little about pier fishing until I got him interested. I had told him about the event—and the quality of our angers—but I think he didn’t really believe it until he saw it first hand.

 Big Rich and sidestripecatcher (Bob)

Big Rich and little old me

Sidestripeseeker (Bob) and a mud marlin

West Coast Dave

It got just a TAD BIT cold!

All right, all right, no one else is going to do it are they? An AMAZING night at the Mud Marlin Derby 2008. 75+ folks entered and by the looks of it plenty of them showed up. Between us, in 6hrs, we caught…… one Mud Marlin.

Congratulations to Red Fish. I guess he took first, second and third place!? James G-Dude lost one early on and I saw one other break-off. Incredible to think last summer there was more bat rays than water in SF Bay.

There were a few smoothounds caught and I lost a good sized shark that looked like a soupfin. That was quite a surreal experience, it zipped line back and forth like a bat ray, then when we finally saw it and discovered it was a nice shark, I was disappointed it wasn’t a bat ray. Not a feeling I ever thought I’d have. It did the death roll and that was that.

Good company tho’, nice to finally meet Captain Sir Ken Jones and Tinle for the first time. I bought along my friend who wants to catch fish. I told him the safest bet in the world is bat rays at BP. He’s 0 for 2 now.

 Posted by salty nick  — Yeah, fishing was slow – but the food was great. Thanks to G-dude for lugging all that out there and cooking. Here are a couple pics of the sunset. Salty.

Sunset — picture by Salty Nick

Posted by mel  — Well, I guess it was just one of them days. Still, I’d do it again in a heartbeat. The trophy eludes me once again but what the heck. What a great tradition the MMD is. Congrats Red for taking home the bacon.

Posted by cheddah — That was my first time fishing BP… needless to say I wasn’t prepared for the cold and windy conditions! Thanks G-Dude for the great food for me and my friends! Saw a really big guy and thought, ‘wow that must be BigRich’ and indeed it was. Nice meeting ya! My friends and I had a good time though I think it would have been better during the day at a less windy pier but of course I know that it’s traditional to have it a BP at night.

West Coast Dave — picture by Salty Nick

Posted by raidersfan1 — Congrats to Redfish as well… was good to see folks I hadn’t seen in quite awhile once again at least since the MMD of 2007. Thanks to Brian (Illcatchanything) for the hot coffee, chili and first time try of leopard shark. Was funny to watch the folks who used the hot sauce like it was tabasco. Also to G-Dude for the pulled pork sandwiches he brought for everyone.  Also to Bob (SSC) for giving me a back support for my chair, that really helped get me through the night. Thanks Bob! Hope your surgery on the 27th goes well and that it takes away your pain. I envy you! Last thing, one of my friends who came out from Oyster Pt, had caught a baby mud marlin around 2lbs at about 15 minutes after the start, but figured it was too small and splashed it without getting it recorded. I called him today to tell him that he would have had 2nd place, he was not the happy fisherman to hear that since he came in 4th place last year missing it by ironically, 2 lbs. Thanks to everyone!.

Posted by illcatchanything — Another great MMD. Lots of fun, if only a few more marlins would have shown…. well… It was nice to see everyone and to meet some new people.

Posted by drudown — Good to see ya’ll out there and congrats to redfish. Was nice to finally meet some pier rats on the board I haven’t met. My bad I didn’t say peace Mike, my hommies were freezing their tails off.

Posted by red fish — Grammar Police wrote: Congrats Red! Sounds like a slow night but good times with friends. I wish me and the family could have made it. We all pretty much came down with a cold thurs/fri of last week. I was looking forward to more photos documenting the night?

I guess that’s how things happen, when you least expect them to. Seven years of being there every year since MMGT #1. There have been at least two years in the seven when there were no more than (4) rays total caught. Only one caught 2008. I remember not even getting a bite the year Baitchucker and his wife came and my girlfriend and I fished. Another year fishing next to Patrick333 before he got married, I broke off a good one on 15# and a sticky Penn drag before Phishinpat brought it to Alantani (the year SteveO got a nice cash prize)… my only bite of that night. 2005, I got 3rd only by 1# more than JohnTheFisherman! Every year Monte showed up, he had a big snap-off… And, of course, as you know, some years the biggest ray of the evening came after midnight… I remember freezing on almost half the events including #1 where I was huddled around the coals on the fire of Bigrich’s BBQ where we really first got to meet… 2008 is the first year I didn’t see MikeJonesJr at the event… 2nd time in (7) I didn’t really fish in the area I usually fish in. Rockfish has been there all seven years and has placed first on two. I think modesty prevented G-Dude from landing the winning fish that he snapped off this year..It was really anybody’s ballgame this year, and I thought anyone would win..I was thinking Minnow perhaps.. Mel, I got lucky this time…and, I think it was the unexpected offering that I dropped in the water to the “Fish Gods” that did it. The most memorable year for me would have to be the ray derby following the death of Stan Low where Tom Aurand purchased a special 1st place trophy that year about three and 1/2 feet tall that was won by a very talented freshwater fisherman from Mississippi, Twigger (he even told me his secret-bait, but that is not what worked for me) that caught the biggest ray to date at a mud-marlin event… The cold weather wasn’t really to my liking and could have kept me away… Event should be planned for late March or early April when spring first hits as a suggestion. Then you will see some mammoth sized fish weighed in. Time to think about other things like Tugboat and cow sharks… Thanks to the founder of the event and all that have put in time and effort to make this thing continue to happen for (7) years.. The emphasis was really on “Get-Together” this time… but, warmer weather must be the #1 priority in the future.. Bob, Jay, Theresa, and Ken ,I am glad you could all make it after prior commitments/arrangements allowed your participation… Huh, I was thinking more of the South Bay Crew would come in under-the-wire; maybe if it was shark fishing? Thanks to all that showed up on a cold summer night in the middle of June

Date: May 20. 2007 — To: PFIC Message Board — From: Ken Jones — Subject: Berkeley Pier MMD #6

I know, I know, when you have a fishing event—Derby, Get-To-Gether, Contest—whatever you call it, it’s about the fish, the biggest and the most. Right? Well, not always. Mud Marlin Derby #6 at the Berkeley Pier Saturday night was about having a good time and the people and good vibes were just as important, if not more important, than the fishing action, which in itself was also pretty darn good.

There were several harbingers giving hint that the night would be special. First off was the walk out to the end before the start of the derby. Several bat rays were already in evidence along with five keeper-size halibut (to 34”), a starry flounder, and buckets filled to the brim with jacksmelt.

Later, as the light faded and the local sky took on a crystalline motif for a couple of hours, a beautiful crescent moon shown bright but was complimented by an equally bright star in the sky—Venus—that seemed to hang like a ornament just under the moon. Only curmudgeons and those too busy being sad to be happy, failed to feel the feeling.

Date: May 20, 2007 — To: PFIC Message Boardm — From: gyozadude — Subject: MMGT 2007 Results

The Mud Marlin derby produced more rays this year than in quite a few years. This caused a shortage of judges running around measuring this year. And further down back towards the foot of the pier, some non-participants were also scoring on some rays. One ray, a monster 70+ pounder that must have been over 10 inches thick and more than 3 1/2 feet across.

The gathering was wonderful, with some old faces, like Stinkyfingers and Dolphinrider, and it wasn’t too long ago, we saw SteveO in Catalina who also showed up. The weather could be much better too. Relatively calm, and just a little chilly. A far cry from the near gale conditions reported nightly with bone-chilling fog earlier in the week.

Food was good, I think. We had chili, ribs, dumplings, yakisoba, subway sandwiches, and hot grilled halibut too (freshly caught by Redfish).

The results are in: Winners: 1st Place — Jeff Garcia – Rockfish with 2 rays (46lb + 17 lbs), 2nd Place — Dustin (guest of a rat with 2 rays – 14 + 10lbs) and West Coast Dave with one ray (24 lbs). Dustin won because in a tie for weight, the win goes to the one with more wingspan, and Dustin had two rays for more wingspan.

More details to come on the scoring. It does not appear that Serenity schooled Grammar Police – on the contrary, GP Joey caught 2 rays I think. But the details are still locked up in the back of the truck, and will stay there until morning, when I wake up and have the energy to clean up. Gyozadude — Proud UPSAC Member   “Yes — I can roll potsticker skins”

Posted by whoshooked — Thanks for organizing the MMGT James! Great food, great fun. My first MMGT and it’s so nice to put faces together with the handles. Excellent prizes for the raffle also! I’m already looking forward to next raffle, er I mean MMGT. BTW, who was the lady interviewing Ken with a microphone?

Posted by Raidersfan1 — Great turnout, great food and pretty good weather too! At least at the end of the pier with SSC’s wind block up. Thanks again to G-Dude and Ken for bringing together another MMD, lots of fun all the way around, lots of Marlins, good prizes for the raffle and putting faces to handles and fishing once again with folks who I myself have not seen in awhile. Although we may have been short on judges, most of the rays caught were near or at the end of the pier were Brian (ICA) and myself were stationed to measure, weigh and report in.

Posted by Ken Jones — GDude is the man who deserves the credit for delivering last night’s baby. He posted it, made up the rules/regs/, organized the judges/judging, helped gather and even wrapped one of the gifts, ordered the trophies, and last but not least hauled about 400 pounds of items out to the gathering before spending his time at the event cooking a wide assortment of items. Between the chili, ribs and coffee out at the end, and the sandwiches, sausages, noodles, and fresh halibut prepared by GDude, there was little reason for anyone to leave hungry. That’s not even mentioning the table of Russian goodies sitting next to GDude nor the pot stickers donated and then cooked up by James. It was a night to gain weight even if you were walking up and down the pier. When combined with some decent fishing, a beautiful night showcasing the Moon and Venus, a not-too-cold evening, and a friendly group of anglers (including several old timers we hadn’t seen in a while), it was one of those special nights.

Posted by Mr. Pole Pack — Great time as always! My son and I had a great time last night! We arrived and set up close to the registration desk. It was pretty crowded but guys who were fishing actually made room for us. Thanks! We brought squid for the rays (skunked) and smoked sausages for G-dude’s grill. Shout out to Red, SSC, GP, Bankie1, Steve W., BigRich, MinnowMagnet, FinPrints, Ken Jones, G-dude, Mel, and anyone else I met last night. The food was plentiful and delicious! My son tried halibut for the first time and loved it. My son was asking me about the event and how everyone knew about it. I told him about the site and explained that everyone had a screen name. So I told him to come up with one. Anthony is now “The Fishinator” The vibe was super-friendly and the weather was great! Can’t wait till next year. P.S. The Hornblower incident was crazy close. Was that a six-ouncer I heard bouncing off?

Redfish and Rockfish (1st Place Winner)

Posted by rockfish — Thanks again to Gyozadude for putting on a great event! The food was awesome as usual and everything was well planned and well run. Also thanks to Ken and and all the other judges who were kept busy walking up and down the pier weighing and measuring fish. My nights fishing started out slow. My son and I went without a bite for the first 4 hrs. About 10:00pm I was thinking of moving my pole to the South side of the pier and decided to check the time with my cell phone. Just then my pole bent and started stripping line, I leaped out of my chair and dropped my phone onto my camp stove when I heard a plunk. I had just dropped my phone right into the pot of water I had cooked with. I quickly plucked out my phone, tossed it to my son and began fighting a good size ray. After a great fight and climbing onto the railing to get around the light pole it was time to get her in the net. Thanks to Thnderr’s skilled net work, my first ray of the night (46lbs) was weighed, measured and lowered back into the water to fight another day. On returning to my stuff I checked my phone and found it’s time to get a new one. I have been needing a new one for a while now anyway. I landed one more ray about 11:30 that weighed in at 17lbs and then got to wrap up a great night with being awarded the first place trophy!

Rockfish and nice mud marlin (bat ray)

Posted by red fish — And BCooney too…representin’ the old “WildBunch” that could not be present in whole of Phishnpat, Elric, OCD, JTF, Messy Marv… Good job on the clean-up G as I was just wondering how folk coming next day were going to perceive the pier as I saw the mess left by some. Rockfish, you had some karma going from MMD’s past… you picked your spot…one I never fish… administered your technique… job well done. Good job at applying rockfish techniques to an area that you don’t fish often… shows adaptability like Ken was talking about…

Posted by illcatchanything — Awesome Night!! Great food, Great turnout, Awesome Weather, and lots of fish!! What more could you ask for. Lots of rays, a few sharks, and Red Fish’s delicious “by catch” halibut.I was really pleased to see the amount of kids out there having a blast. A great night of fishing and friendship.

Redfish and Dustin (friend of Raidersfan 1) who was the 2nd Place Winner

Posted by Raidersfan1 — Oh, I feel much better this morning than I did when I walked off the pier last night with ICA and SS23 at 2:30am. Being a judge and walking the pier from the registration desk to the end became a challenge, as I didn’t want to leave the windbreak that SSC had placed up. The weather at the end was great, no wind, calm water, good food and lots of fun.

The Hornblower yacht kept cutting in too close to the end of the pier and risking fouling lines

However, the adrenaline really kicked into gear when the Hornblower yachts would blow through leaving everyone to scramble to pull their lines in. Most of the action was near the end of the pier, which kept ICA and myself busy. Lots of missed opportunities by Jay, Dustin and RedFish. SSC finally caught a ray at the Derby. SS23′s gargantuan hoop net made most rays look tiny in the midst of it. When the derby was over and the winners rewarded for their efforts, it seemed that the bite at the end began to take off. Some big rays were fought and brought up on deck by Joey (Grammar Police) and Jay (Ilovefishing).

Joey (Grammer Police) and a mud marlin

No derby is complete without one photo of someone on the wall, this time it was Joey relaxing as he was helping Redfish with his ray. As much as we wanted to see Serenity school Joey, it was not meant to be last night. Was great to see everyone again and meet new board members as well as old. No other place I would want to be last night.

Posted by gyozadude — Chronology — Stats and Bat Ray List — Looks like quite a few of the coordinators got there later that we thought we would. Apologies for that. I guess there were a number of graduation ceremonies and games yesterday that clogged 101, 237, 880, and of course the average driving IQ of the Bay Area has gone to hell in a Hand Basket because of the 580-80 overpass fire and subsequent destruction of 100 yds of overpass roadway. Needless to say, after taking two hours to come in from the south bay, I was feeling a little bad about getting there late and forcing folks to all crowd around the registration table at 5:45pm and possibly starting a few minutes late.

I was happy to know that down at the end, Redfish, SSC and Grammar Police had already set up shop. Red and SSC are pretty much our de facto Berkeley Pier regulars and in prior UPSAC conference call meetings, it was good to get thumbs up on date and time from Red for the event in the prior weeks leading up to this event. Red is also the official home pier host and presenter for the trophies.

Joey (Grammer Police) and his better half

Dragging my pier cart from the parking lot near Skates wasn’t too bad. I had rehearsed the 450 lb loading up and bungee cord thing earlier in the day and I over pressurized my tires and lubed the bearings and chassis of the cart to reduce rolling resistant.

I was really glad to meet up with Raidersfan1 (Mike) and the Skipper, Ken, just minutes after getting to the 10th lamppost from the end. Ken took over the raffle sales, and Mike handled the registrations and sign-in forms. I was unloading food, and setting up to cook, plus putting together judges packages.

Total officially signed-in personnel: 75. We had 93 pre-registered, so it wasn’t so bad of a flake out factor.

Thanks to all the donors and sponsors and pier rats who bought tix for the raffle – you helped raise $442 dollars in the raffle. This amount “smoked” the Catalina raffle, which only raised $261. Unfortunately, Catalina has been smoked in more ways than one. This does not include proceeds from T-shirt sales that add from $60 – $100 per event as well.

Rods and reels were ready!

We really need to thank Oyster Pt. Bait & Tackle (two Penn Reels), Gotcha Bait & Tackle (two gift certificates for $25 each), Alan Tani (five service tickets good for free service and drag tune-up), Raidersfan1 (Berkeley Lightning rod and legwork at Oyster Pt.), Grammar Police (classic Pfleuger Sea King conventional reel tuned by Alan Tani, StripedsideChaser (hitting up Gotcha B/T), and Bankie_1 (pier railing rod holder) for their generous donations and legwork in soliciting gifts. Oh, and I can’t forget Pablo and his company Polepack.com for donating two nice polepack bags to a couple of lucky winners. I hope the folks found the raffle pretty exciting and rewarding. Lots of good stuff. And there were some cheesy filling items too. But all winners were gracious. I think MJonesJr has two more bait knives now. I’m not sure what he’ll do with them, but hey, I have like four of those in stock myself since I use those to cut weeds and roots in the garden too.

Grand prize custom rod went to Damon Knudson, one of the folks in the FishermanKing8 party. And I think Wa Mouk in West Coast Dave’s party is missing a Daiwa 3500-series spinning reel, which I still have for you. Email me (address somewhere in a clickable link in my .sig below) so I can figure how to get the prize over to you. And somebody is grinning with that beautiful Pfleuger Sea King which looked awesome.

Thanks to all of LosAmigos4′s party and their kids for helping draw the tickets in the raffle.

Folks are curious about the bat rays. We had some really big break offs on lots of the pilings but 22 rays were landed and measured. Winner is by aggregate weight of all rays caught. And in the case of a tie, the greater wingspan total wins. It was a pretty close contest and much of it decided around between 11pm – midnight.

Bat Ray Chronology — 2007 May 19 — MMGT 2007 — Berkeley, CA

Time (pm)  —  Angler — Net Wt. (lbs.)  — Wingspan (in.)

6:45 — Javier (LosAmigos 4), 6.0 lbs., 22 in. — 6:50 — Ilovefishing, 13 lbs., 25 in. — 6:55 — Surf_fisher, 6 lbs., 21.5 in. —  6:59 — Ilovefishing, 11 lbs., 22 in. —  8:25     Jesse (thnderr), 5 lbs., 20 in. — 8:28  — Jay (Ilovefishing),  20 lbs,  29 in. — 9:50 —      Rockfish, 46 lbs., 40 in. — 10:20 — Whoshooked, 4 lbs., 19 in. — 10:30 —  Red fish, 20 lbs., 29 in. — 10:42 —  Ray (Raidersfan1),  23  lbs., 33 in. — 11:00 — Grammar Police, 10 lbs., 23.5 in. — 11:05 —  Bernabe (LosAmigo4),  7 lbs.,  22 in. — 11:20 —   Stripesidechaser, 11 lbs.,  23 in. — 11:25 —  Lucio Lara Jr.(LosAmigos4), 8 lbs.,  22 in. — 11:29 —  Eugene (Raidersfan1), 10  lbs., 23 in. — 11:30  — West Coast Dave, 24 lbs., 31 in. — 11:30  — Shane (Raidersfan1), 6 lbs., 22 in. — 11:40 —  Grammar Police, 10 lbs., 23.5 in. — 11:40  — Rockfish, 17 lbs., 32 in. — 11:45  — Bankie_1, 9.5  lbs.,  23 in. — 11:45 — Surf_fisher, 8 lbs.,  22 in. — 11:50 —  Jerel (Mr. Polepack), 7.5 lbs., 23 in.

Technically, I wasn’t really skunked, but I was. Shane hooked up around 11:50 pm to a small ray, but it drifted right over to my line and also took my bait. When we started hauling the ray in, we found both hooks in the mouth, but Shane’s looked like it was hooked first and more deeply. So I gave that fish over. But I may claim at least 2 ozs. of credit to stop the skunk. Gyozadude – Proud UPSAC Member  “Yes – I can roll potsticker skins”

Posted by gyozadude — The cuisine—I already posted about SSC’s chili. But someone brought ribs too, and Bankie_1 brought sandwich fixings, someone brought coffee, someone dropped off hot dogs and buns, and someone else brought pork dumplings which I grilled (aka Potsticker-style), and I also brought yakisoba (Japanese-style chow mein), a pack of Polska Kielbasa, and I had my hot ham/turkey/roast beef sandwich fixings on multigrain bread and assortment of cold drinks.

So I’d say folks should have had enough to eat and be merry. Plus, I had a bunch of butter with me, and SSC filleted Redfish’s 30+ inch halibut caught earlier in the day and left the slabs on a foil sheet next to my grill. He even sent the kids back on scooters with garlic seasoning for the butter too.

I did fire up the grill and cook the slabs of halibut and it pretty much disappeared quickly. I gotta thank all the kids for hauling stuff back and forth – on foot or by scooter. For all the food that was dropped off, or that Bankie_1 made, I think I was down to two small packs of deli roast beef, some bread and 4 bottles of water. Hot dogs – gone! Kielbasa – gone! Potstickers – gone! yakisoba – gone! canned sodas – gone! 2/3rds of my sandwich fixes and all my butter – gone! I came in heavy. But went back was a lot lighter.

Posted by west coast dave — I had a great time. I finally got rid of the skunk. After catching 4 Bat Rays back in 2002 at the first MMD, I haven’t caught any in the following years 03,04,05,06. So catching that 24-lb Bat Ray was sweet. And winning 3rd place was sweeter. It was also nice seeing you all again. And once again, big thanks for the great cooking G-Dude. And a special thank you to Redfish for sharing his Halibut with all of us.

Red Fish and West Coast Dave (3rd Place Winner)

Posted by red fish — Nice going Dave… and the other winners… There were a lot of fine fishermen there… what I have always said, “There are a lot of folks here that can fish,” referring to PFIC. When I saw Rockfish sign up, an eyebrow went up… a true contender… he’s got a few secrets. Great to see all the old folks: to include Tom, Dave, Mike and Michael, Martin, Lisa, Steve… the people we don’t get to see as much of. Guys I have fished with from Novato including Jay and his second place buddy fishing next to me… Dustin… All the people from Antioch..SSC.. I will see you during the fall run. Mike and his nephew and all the Oyster Point fishers. way to tough out that clunk on the head Kevin… Joey, Shannon and dad representing the FosterCityCrew… thanks for the tips on the two-hook shark-trace, supporting the raffle… G-Dude. for putting this thing together once again and withstanding two hours of grueling traffic on 880 N. from the A’s game… all the people who got donations for the raffle… KJ for bringing us all together and driving way from Lodi at night to be there… There was a lot of spirit of the group…esprit de corp as Dan put it once… all our regular fishing buddies ICA Rich, Mel, Minnow, heck even James & Julie came out to represent after a night on the town … Thanks to Alan Tani for tight drags and his contributions… Jon of old PJ Crew… and those that couldn’t show up but were there in spirit like Alabama, James Peach, YN’ckz, Bodega Boyz… As Rich once said: “It’s the people that make the event.”

Posted by stripesidechaser — Thanks to all, it was great! I had a blast, hanging out with Mike, Ken, Robert, Joey, Shannon, Kevin and all the others. Actually chased the skunk away with my first MMGT ray, as well as the raffle skunk with one of the Penn 60 reels PLUS an Alan Tani ticket! I was absolutely amazed that 30 lbs of chili (yes, calculated right at 30 lbs) could possibly go in under two hours… now that was a new MMGT record!

Sidestripechase and Red’s halibut

 Posted by SturgeonSlayer2 — Had a great time at the MMD hanging all night at the end with Mike, Bob, Joey, Shannon, Lucio (+family), Red, Minnow and meeting Ken, G-dude, and a whole bunch others. Got to use my new net tonight, (no thanks to me), so thanks to everyone who brought in rays. My fishing skill just wasn’t cutting it at the MMD, but it was no matter because I had a great time just relaxing and talking with new and old people. Chili and all the rest of the grub were great, so thanks to everyone who hauled it all out. Long night at the BP, but well worth it! I just gotta get rid of Reds singing in my head, “Minnow and the rest!” ha. Thanks again everyone for making the night a great one. -SS23.

Posted by serenityonthebay — Well folks, I didn’t school GP, this time. In fact, I was totally skunked (I did win a Penn reel in the raffle though!!)… In hindsight…the slow night allowed for me to stay on top of the coffee (VITAL part of good fishing), get to meet and know a bit more about some pretty fabulous people and visit with my old-timer father who showed up with a buddy and 6 racks of smoked ribs. Thank you all for allowing me to be part of such a fantastic event! I can’t wait for next year!

The end with its wind block was crowded as usual

Date: June 25, 2006 — To: PFIC Message Board — From: Ken Jones — Subject: Mud Marlin Derby 2006

It was 105 degrees in Ukiah when we left the wedding we were attending and hurried down to Berkeley… where the temperature was 59, the sun was missing, and the wind was blowing. I didn’t even try to fish but had a chance to say hi to many of the 70+ people in attendance who were braving the elements. And, had a chance to introduce Mrs. Jones to the event and some of the people she has heard me mention. Not too many fish (actually none while I was there) but a friendly group as always and hot coffee out at the end. Thanks to all who organized the event, provided prizes, and did the 101 things that are necessary when hosting such a shindig. I’ll let GDude and Redfish provide a more thorough report but thanks to all of you, both for attending the Mud Marlin Derby and being members of the Pier Fishing In California family.

Posted by grammar police — I had a blast Ken, ’twas good meeting Ms. Jones. Yes, a successful event is never complete without thanking those who gave their time, effort, and money. Looking forward to number 6. Long live the Raffle King! Thank you Gdude (times 2), RedFish, SSC and Ms. Bob (Sorry never caught your wife’s name!), Rita and Eric, all judges (1014, MM, etc.). My hat is off, once again for you fine men and women. A special shout out to Mr. & Ms. BaitChucker for providing the fine reel to match my new 10′ custom G-dude!

Quote of the night: “Is Joey here? I want to buy raffle tickets before he arrives or buys the whole roll!” Best advise for the night: Buying raffle tickets every 20 mins. or a chunk here and there till their gone, is how to maximize your chances. Best raffle advice: Have ungodly luck.

Posted by orkspace — Congrats on your winnings Joey. I’ll get ya next time. —Dan

Posted by 1014 — Can a Judge be a judge.. if the judge has nothing to judge? Skunk for us folks on the inside. but still nice meeting the folks: GP, Pierbum, Salty Nick, 2d (mahalos for the dvds), Jel (mahalos for the musubi), G-Dude, Redfish, Rita, Big Rich, and countless others. Sorry we didn’t venture to the end, but we shy lol.

Posted by pierhead — Re: “70+ people in attendance … 141 people RSVP’d and only 70+ showed up? Once upon a time people who failed to show up without indicating they were backing out were considered just plain inconsiderate and weren’t invited back. There is a world of difference between provisioning for 70 instead of 141 and the hosts get stuck with the extra costs for food and supplies. So what is the solution … accept every RSVP but only plan for 50% showing up? That certainly is one approach but what happens if more than 50% attend? Good luck with the GPGT … I hope it doesn’t happen to whoever is organizing it this year.

Posted by pescare — Not the first time, unfortunately. It seems that not enough people think being inconsiderate is such a bad thing anymore. I remember that the ’04 Goleta thing had about a 50% no-show rate too, and from what I’ve observed, you can pretty much count on about a 30% rate in general.

Posted by songslinger — Roster Unfurnished Each Year. It would be interesting to see a list of names after these events. And useful, too. You show up, there are a whole bunch of people and you talk to most of them, but no one is wearing nametags, it’s getting dark, and there is also the incidental thing called Fishing. Had to keep track. So, I’m always wondering why, amidst the pictures and reports, someone doesn’t provide a “final count” for the record. Not to shame those who didn’t show–that’s just a perq—but to give everyone a source to put names to faces and so on.

I agree in principle about reservations and cancellations. Still, how useful is it to say you’re not coming if you’ve only just decided? Up here in the Bay Area, weather changes quickly, microclimates brew their own rarefied systems within the System–ask anyone who arrives at Berkeley Pier wearing shorts and tank-tops because it was 50 degrees warmer on the other side of the hills. I’ve seen hopeful anglers walk to the foot of the pier and get blasted by our hellish foggy zephyrs. Bright optimism stripped away raw to disappointment and disgust. Who can blame them for turning back? There’s fun and there is futility.

            The MMD event this year lists 59 separate reservations. Of that, you can pare down several names. Eelmaster, Ken Jones, and Minnow Magnet, each are double entries. (MM’s dad RR also reserved two—same guys.) So there are 5 you can subtract. 2 of Big Rich’s 3 reservations are imaginary, and Red Fish’s 11 invitees can be chopped back to maybe 4 or 5 at best. Some people who signed up for many only arrived with a few. You can also reasonably assume that guests would be less given the weather. So if there were 70 people at the event, this could be 59 people, 11 of whom brought a guest. And not everyone registered or checked in.  My point: who knows who showed up?

Berkeley Pier can’t be compared to Goleta or other events. The ENTIRE event takes place on the pier. Few participants stay overnight; most drive there and back on the same day. No bbq or picnic areas have to be reserved. As for food, it’s fantastic that generous people put together some tasty meals and feed a lot of folks. They can anticipate a crowd, yes, but they cannot expect it. Because things change. And those who attend events should not expect to get fed. It’s casual. (It’s Berkeley, man.) It’s close to spontaneous. Or it really isn’t worth doing. Sorry Glen

Posted by baitchucker — “hellish foggy zephyrs”  Ya, maybe I ate just a little too much chili, carnitas, and cevichi! It was good to meet you while on your way down the pier.

Posted by stripesidechaser — It got a little foggy on my end (of the pier) after about the third bowl of chili!  I fish, therefore I lie!

Posted by Songslinger — Heh heh!

 Posted by ken Jones — When Pat and I arrived at around 8:30 I asked Rita how many people had signed in and I believe the answer was 70 at that time. She did say some had signed in while the friends with them did not sign in. So, an actual number versus the posted signup will be hard.

As Slinger said the signup was rough. Some people anticipated bringing several other people and that may or may not have happened. It was cold, no doubt about that and that too may have discouraged some people (it reminded me of MMD2 when Lucy was given some ultramodern NASA-like garment to keep her warm (and it worked). Bottom line though was that more than 70 people showed up, most seemed to be enjoying themselves, and fishing proved once again how unpredictable it can be.

The one I felt most sorry for was GDude who was wearing his ever-present shorts and freezing. Someone finally brought him a blanket but I sure hope he was able to warm up after the event. He said, by the way, that the raffle was successful and UPSAC resources are somewhat strengthened.

 As for the coffee and chili, I only partook of the coffee because we had just finished off a nice spread at a wedding reception in Ukiah. The coffee was hot and that was all that mattered. The coffee cup helped warm up the cold fingers and the coffee itself warmed the soul. As said earlier, thanks and well done to all.

Posted by mel — I’m binging my own hotdogs next time. The ones that Unclesteve brings are way too hot for me.”The exact names and places may be changed to protect the innocent”

Posted by dkkim — Man those hotdogs were good. I think we ate enough for all the folks that didn’t show. btw, I headed out early but right when I was near the bathrooms I hear hootin’ and hollering — “Hookup!” I looked down at the watch and it was 11:55. Glad to hear you got the last fish, and it was nice meeting you.

Posted by gyozadude — Whew, I survived the cold – Part 1

However many fish were lost last night, and however cold it was, and however tired I was driving home… I’m happy that had the chance to get out and just hang out with a line in the water with many of the folks who came out for this event.

For the folks that stuck it out in the end, pat yourself on the back. Berkeley Pier can be worse, but for MMGT, this was perhaps one of the coldest and breeziest in past years.

Yet, time flew quickly. I got there at 4pm, parking near Skates Restaurant and while it was sunny at the time, the wind was already blowing hard. Up until that point, I had been working like a dog on an emergency software project and suffering from sleep deprivation the last six weeks, so my memory isn’t all that great. But it felt like just moments after I setup tables and got cozy that the clock struck 6pm and the MMGT officially started, and there was Rita001 manning the front desk doing the sign-ups, and a pile of cool prizes were on my cart behind me. And as usual, we had crowds arrive near starting time who needed to sign-in and wanted to buy some raffle tickets, so I started selling raffle tix next to Rita.

Sometime during that lapse, I must have also handed out the judges clipboards with rule sets to the folks that volunteered. And thank goodness I spotted Raidersfan1 taking movies and stills, so I didn’t need to walk down to the end of the pier, and shoot some amateur pics with my five year old Fuji finepix A101.

But I think I blinked twice and suddenly, someone blew the fog over BP and it got really cold. Great for folks like Ken Jones and Mrs. Jones who were coming down from the scalding hot interior somewhere. But I was wearing shorts and I looked around to see if Mel had pulled this unbelievable meteoroligic trick with the fog.

Posted by gyozadude — Raffle time – Part 2

Wow! Some cool prizes we gave away. Notably, we had a donation from Charkbait.com and Baitchucker of an Avet MX reel that went with a custom rod I wrapped which I christened “Go-bo-cha” which is a Japanese pumpkin that is green and orange. We also had a donation from Gotcha Bait and Tackle in Antioch c/o Stripedsidechaser for a cool Okuma Coronado CD65 Baitfeeder. Monte donated a half dozen lure paint kits, and someone (please email me) donated another Jarvis Walker big spinning reel. And Redfish donated a 7 ft Sabre Pacifica 1 pc heavy stick. I think Davey Jones came buy and brought a fantastic grab bag of goodies too, and Matt – 2D donated some stuff too.

But there is a disturbing trend starting to happen in ticket buying that started at Catalina PFGT this year. Grammar Police took top prize at that raffle too by blowing $90 in tix. So this time around, Orkspace blew $80 on tix. And GP blew $50, and others blew $40 and $30. I was almost running out of tickets physically. And then GP came around again and pretty much bought some more tix in a second purchase, after which we pretty much sold out or only had 6 left.

At 8pm, we began the drawing with a pretty good crowd. While this raffle only had only about 25 items to raffle off. My appreciation goes out the kids at the MMGT that helped out in picking of winning tix. One by one, we raffled off items getting ever closer to the bigger items.

Two things we did differently here from the Catalina PFGT. a) we had fewer prizes, but bigger ticket items, and b) I spent about a good 15 minutes separating tickets and mixing them thoroughly, stirring the tix and interleaving them between others. This would hopefully avoid one person winning too many prizes.

When we finally got to the big water reels and rod, folks were definitely paying more attention to their numbers. Then came the grand prize, and winner was…. Grammar Police!  Ironically, Orkspace did not get a single prize. And GP Joey, only won 1 prize — which was the grand prize after all. For those who envy Joey’s good luck, well, he wasn’t all that lucky. You see, while trying to unload at 4pm, a sudden burst of air lifted the custom rod off the roof of my camper shell, and the rod fell down and chipped the top ring. The rod is back with me to repairs.

Posted by gyozadude — Survival Station Lampost 20 — Part 3

 The action seemed hot down at the end of the pier, and I should have walked down there, and in hindsight, I missed out.

SSC (aka Bob) had a pot of chili and hot coffee going, which would have been great for a guy like me who was cold to the bone. They also had the whole end tarped and shielded from two sides against the wind. Some one also was toasting hot wings and sausages too, I heard.

But I was just too tired and lazy to hoof it down to the end. And certainly, while it was a cold night, Climber9′s father offered a blanket which I thankfully borrowed..

But we weren’t without a burrito bar on our end. I brought black beans and carnitas and tortillas and a case of bottled water, and we can thank Eric and Rita who did all the cooking plus brought the Spanish rice.

And before dusk, a gentleman was cleaning a very nice striper at the sink nearby. I thought he was part of the MMGT crew and we were going to have fresh striper. But that must have been wishful thinking.

Posted by gyozadude — And the winners are… Part 4

It was a slow MMGT. A few good fish lost at the end, but otherwise quiet. And only three rays landed. Throughout the evening, we heard loud “Whhhhooooaaaaa’s” of disappointment occasionally come from the end with no confirmations of any fish landed.

At 10:23pm, HikingJay finally took the lead with a 12 lb. ray with a 26 inch wingspan. But that didn’t last long when Louisana Jeff landed a 36 pound ray with a 38 inch wingspan at 10:35pm. This still could have been anyone’s contest until Mel (who lost one earlier supposedly that broke off on 65 lb braid) hooked up at 11:58 pm. The fight went past midnight, but the ray did get landed before the 10 minute grace period expired. Mel closed the MMGT2006 with a 9 lb ray with a 22 inch wingspan.

So, the winners were: Louisana Jeff (1st), HikingJay (2nd) and Mel (3rd). Each received an engraved trophy and a PolePack courtesy of Pablo-at-Polepack-dot-com. He says he can exchange it for whichever size winners want.

Congrats to the winners again on a job well done. Gyozadude – Proud UPSAC Member “Yes — I can roll potsticker skins”

Posted by AortizFish — Thanks to Gotcha Bait Shop  for their donations! I actually won the Okuma reel in the raffle, I had a great time out there. Met a lot of people, Thanks to all the organizers.

Posted by Mr. Pole Pack — Pole Pack winners…Congratulations on your rays! Email me if you want to exchange sizes to fit your rods.pablo@polepack.com

Posted by 1014 — Thanks James… and Redfish, Rita, Eric, etc.  I came with a pair of shorts and t-shirt as well, but quickly the jacket came on with my fleece wader lining, which was luckily still in my bag, following quickly afterwards. I tried to rough it out by continually walking back and forth from bathroom/food vendor and spot, but couldn’t take it. My wife withstood the cold longer than I did wearing her “skort” until almost dusk! Again no fish in our general area, or actually no qualifying fish. The scale was used to weigh a 5# striper caught by one of the old men near us and Jel’s homies caught a 31” leopard. But it was quiet on our end. I did get a nibble on squid but whatever it was refused to take the hook. Geez, I was hoping for at least third place! I will say the burritos hit the spot and reminiscing with 2d about Sandy’s poundings kept me warm. Also the daydreaming my conversation with Pierbum about threshers got me sweating. Thanks again, and definitely I’ll participate more so next year!

Posted by gyozadude — Really, thanks Red. Robert was our main guy for communications on the MMGT and he insulated me from having to deal with it, especially since I was completely bogged down in work and other activities. All I really ended up doing was hauling out the same gear I usually haul to one of these events. In years past, when I tried to organize this, there had been always some opposition that some pier regulars would feel displaced by such a massive invasion and that we should grease the locals and make them feel welcome and give them a heads-up before the event. With Robert in charge, I don’t think that issue even came up since he’s a regular there himself. So let’s hear it Robert for being the gracious host here.

Posted by Ken Jones — You both did a great job!

Posted by songslinger — JAFO’s view here from the day shift, but it was a respectable and respectful event.

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